Aaron Francis

Ian and Aaron talk about everything from Interstellar to the Late Night Wars of the 90s to speaking at conferences to maybe the greatest question of the week: what do you want to do when you retire? Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and CodeRabbit Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. 00:00 Let's Not Talk About Bluesky 05:40 Pay Homage / Respect 11:30 Playing Some Poker 23:51 What Do You Want To Do When You Retie 34:47 HelpSpot BackOffice 47:16 Interstellar 54:12 Commit Your Code 01:09:40 I Don't Wittle 01:14:08 Expand & Contract

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Transcript

Ian

00:00:00 – 00:00:00

Hello?

Aaron

00:00:01 – 00:00:02

Hello. How are we doing today?

Ian

00:00:03 – 00:00:04

Doing good. You?

Aaron

00:00:04 – 00:00:06

You ready to talk about blue sky for two hours?

Ian

00:00:06 – 00:00:07

Let's do it.

Aaron

00:00:07 – 00:00:09

Let's do it. Gosh.

Ian

00:00:10 – 00:00:17

Now you have you put on the list that you wanna talk about blue sky for five minutes. This is after last night. You said you're done talking about it.

Aaron

00:00:17 – 00:00:32

I'm done offering opinions on blue sky. The good news is, Jennifer didn't get to garage talk on last episode because we hit it behind an hour and a half of blue sky. So she's still in the dark about, what's about to happen at our house.

Ian

00:00:32 – 00:00:34

She thinks you're a normal husband.

Aaron

00:00:34 – 00:00:41

She thinks I'm very normal. Yeah. And that all those diggers are for somebody else. Yes. Yes.

Aaron

00:00:41 – 00:00:54

Let's not talk about blue sky save for just this. I'm I'm done offering opinions on blue sky. Everyone has. It's become, and maybe it always has been. And I've been ignorant to this.

Aaron

00:00:56 – 00:01:06

Very religious. It's, it's the same as, it's the same as politics. It's the same as them versus I. What is it? Emacs.

Aaron

00:01:06 – 00:01:20

It's the same Mac versus Windows. It's just very tribal now. And like I said, maybe it always has been, and I just haven't been paying attention. I'm open to that. But, yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't enrich my life.

Aaron

00:01:20 – 00:01:35

I try to like, you know, I try to talk about somebody was responding to, I think, Justin Jackson. I think his name's Fred. Followed him for a long time. And I responded and was like, yeah. I don't feel like, you know, blue sky and Twitter are fundamentally different.

Aaron

00:01:35 – 00:01:49

It just feels like they target different audiences. And somebody came in the replies and was like, boy, you spend a lot of energy complaining about being here when it doesn't seem like you wanna be here. And I'm like, oh, okay. I just thought this isn't good for me. I don't enjoy this.

Aaron

00:01:49 – 00:01:53

So I took the app off my phone. Oh, man. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

00:01:53 – 00:02:14

So I'll still, I'll still, you know, participate over there. But in here and there. Check-in. I think I was, I was enjoying some of the conversation about the differences, but now it's gotten to a point where it's like, I don't enjoy this. A lot of people have way stronger opinions than I do and are trying to convince me of their point of view.

Aaron

00:02:15 – 00:02:34

And even like some some friends, I feel like it's it's like exposing it's exposing rifts that don't need to be there. It's like, I just I don't care that much. And so I'm just going to keep my opinions to myself because I'm not interested in debate. So that's it. Yeah, it's over.

Aaron

00:02:35 – 00:02:36

I mean, I think that's fine. I think

Ian

00:02:36 – 00:02:45

that that's where it's, like, I guess it's, like, to me, the people who felt strongly that they disliked Twitter. Right? For whichever there's a couple main reese

Aaron

00:02:45 – 00:02:46

themes

Ian

00:02:46 – 00:02:55

to that. Right? They found a new place and they're happy about that. And I'm in that crew. I've been looking for a new place for a long time, not just the, since the elections since way before that.

Ian

00:02:55 – 00:03:05

And it's like, okay, it's a new place. So you get happy or excited. You want your old friends to come to the new place, all that kind of stuff. Right? And so on that arc, I think that arc just needs to be done.

Ian

00:03:05 – 00:03:13

Like, blue sky's big enough now that, like, you don't need to, like, tell everybody you ever knew, hey. You should come to blue sky. Like, they know about Blue Sky.

Aaron

00:03:13 – 00:03:18

You don't need to go post on Twitter how much fun you're having on Blue Sky. Need to do that. Like, that

Ian

00:03:18 – 00:03:20

was fine for a little while. I think that served its purpose.

Aaron

00:03:20 – 00:03:21

Totally.

Ian

00:03:21 – 00:03:34

But, like, we everybody's got it, and they can they now notice if people get sick of Twitter for their own reasons at some point. They know there's a Twitter like substitute. If they don't, then they stay there, then that's fine. Right? That doesn't matter.

Ian

00:03:34 – 00:03:41

And, on the other side, I think, you know, I think when you come into it, like, asking,

Aaron

00:03:42 – 00:03:45

How to change it and make it into Twitter? Yeah. Like, you know,

Ian

00:03:45 – 00:03:59

I like like, I think if you would just be in charge using it. Like, if you just came in and just used it, like, use Twitter. Like, I'm gonna build 2,000 mutes, and I'm just gonna do that. And I'm just gonna just use it like I use Twitter. I think you would have probably had less of that because it's, like, whatever.

Ian

00:03:59 – 00:04:09

Like, if it wasn't if you came in a year from now, there wouldn't be this, like, hey. I'm here on the new thing and, like Mhmm. What's going on in the new thing? You'd just be like, okay. Like, how do I do this?

Ian

00:04:09 – 00:04:21

Okay. I do it like this, and I'm just gonna do use it like I use Twitter because it's the same thing, you know, roughly. And you wouldn't you don't even have to have those conversations at that point. Right? It's like, who cares?

Ian

00:04:21 – 00:04:22

Like, right,

Aaron

00:04:22 – 00:04:22

we're

Ian

00:04:22 – 00:04:24

not we're not here to talk about the meta of the platform. I'm just

Aaron

00:04:24 – 00:04:24

like Yeah.

Ian

00:04:25 – 00:04:38

I'm off of this thing or I'm using it in conjunction together, which I think for content guys like you, I mean, it's just another platform. Like, who cares? Like, yeah, I get that there's, like, the difference of, like, where do you wanna spend your personal time?

Aaron

00:04:39 – 00:04:39

Yeah. It

Ian

00:04:39 – 00:04:52

has that aspect to it. Right? But then there's still just the, like, content people should just be everywhere, like Yeah. Anywhere. Like, whether or not you use it heavy or not heavy, like, whatever, but you should probably be posting I mean, mean, you should probably be posting yourself on Facebook too.

Ian

00:04:52 – 00:05:05

Right? Like, I don't know if you do or not, but Yeah. It's probably a mistake not to because it doesn't Probably. Not it doesn't hurt to have it there and not having it there is potentially whatever. Some percentage of people who now will never find you.

Ian

00:05:05 – 00:05:08

Mhmm. But yeah. So Yeah. I think

Aaron

00:05:08 – 00:05:27

that's a that's a good distinction. I don't I don't plan on spending at least for now, I'm open to this changing. I don't plan on spending my personal hang time on blue sky, and that's just totally fine with me. And I'm not gonna try to convince anyone that that's a good idea or a bad idea. I'm just going to do whatever I want to do.

Ian

00:05:27 – 00:05:32

Do what you wanna do. Yeah. I think that's fine. And, yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

00:05:32 – 00:05:35

I don't have anything to add to that. I think that's good. That was a tight five.

Ian

00:05:35 – 00:05:36

We're done. That's all

Aaron

00:05:36 – 00:05:37

I needed.

Ian

00:05:37 – 00:05:41

There we go. Got that off your chest. Hey. Something I've got here. Like,

Aaron

00:05:41 – 00:05:42

you know, I

Ian

00:05:42 – 00:05:50

had to pay respect, pay homage to the OG greatest. Who? Late Show with David Letterman.

Aaron

00:05:50 – 00:05:55

Late Show with David Letterman. Something I have never watched in my life. Oh, man. I

Ian

00:05:55 – 00:05:57

didn't watch a Late Show.

Aaron

00:05:57 – 00:06:02

It's possible. It's possible we're of different generations. We're not that far apart, but it's possible.

Ian

00:06:03 – 00:06:13

That's one of those things that's on the line there. I think that's yeah. You were just in his, like, real prime where, like, the teenagers and young 20 were all about it. You were just a little too young there probably.

Aaron

00:06:13 – 00:06:16

I think I was a little too young for that. Yeah.

Ian

00:06:16 – 00:06:24

A late show. David, there's no this is, like, one of those things that's been totally lost. You know? It's like there's no David Letterman anymore. Like, it just doesn't exist.

Ian

00:06:25 – 00:06:28

There's no David Letterman. These other, like, guys are all watered down.

Aaron

00:06:28 – 00:06:31

Jay Leno, or did one of them succeed succeed?

Ian

00:06:31 – 00:06:45

So here Come after this. Called the, what they call the the late night wars, I think they call this. Mhmm. They made a pretty good movie about it, which you should watch if you have time. It's like a, it's like a HBO, which I don't know, which is really good when you retire.

Ian

00:06:45 – 00:06:57

But so David's main thing, when he became famous in the shift after that. So he was on after Johnny Carson. Okay. In the 12/30 to 01:30 slot. Okay.

Ian

00:06:57 – 00:07:10

And that's and so he could kinda do whatever he wanted. Like, it was like nobody, you know, and this was like the eighties or whatever. Nobody was up at 12:30 unless you were, like, a degenerate. And so he was, like, pushing the boundaries. So that's what he was, like, edgy.

Ian

00:07:10 – 00:07:26

And then he wanted to be on prime time, but, like, you had Carson and you had, whoever I think there was, like, a new show on the one channel or something and whatever. There wasn't a spot. Eventually a spot opened up for him. He, he was assuming he would take over for Carson. That was always,

Aaron

00:07:26 – 00:07:31

and Carson was late show or tonight show tonight show. Okay. So tonight show's the big show. That's the one you want.

Ian

00:07:31 – 00:07:53

That was the biggest. Johnny Carson was the biggest of these late night guys for thirty years or forty years or whatever. So when he retired, Letterman figured he would be like, he was the heir apparent. It was like, no one, he was the heir apparent, but then I think he was maybe too edgy or whatever. So they gave him to Jay Leno and that like freaked, Letterman freaked out, blah, blah.

Ian

00:07:53 – 00:07:59

So he went to CBS and started the late show with Dave Letterman to directly compete with Leno at the same 11:30.

Aaron

00:07:59 – 00:08:00

Oh, the same slot.

Ian

00:08:00 – 00:08:09

Yeah. So then they were both on 11:30, but he had to move network. Because back then, there was only three networks. So you had to be you know, those are the slots. There was no YouTube or whatever.

Ian

00:08:10 – 00:08:22

So that was the whole thing. And it was a big battle, which I think Leno always, like, had the ratings. Maybe Letterman eventually won the the ratings at one point, but, Letterman was always way funnier. I mean, Leno is fine, but he's kinda just

Aaron

00:08:22 – 00:08:23

like is fine. Yeah.

Ian

00:08:23 – 00:08:29

He runs the show and, like, whatever. Like, Fallon, fine. You know, a guest comes on, and maybe there's a little funny thing or two, but he's not

Aaron

00:08:29 – 00:08:31

like Fallon Fallon's not very funny.

Ian

00:08:31 – 00:08:41

He's not must watch TV. Letterman was like, you must watch. You need to watch what he's gonna do with these different scenarios. So, so anyway, Letterman's great. He's still great.

Ian

00:08:41 – 00:08:48

He's like, now he's like, he's the perfect guy to be like the old, old curmudgeon comic. You know, he's just like got the huge beard.

Aaron

00:08:48 – 00:08:50

He's got the big Jesus beard now. Right? Yeah. He's got the

Ian

00:08:50 – 00:08:52

huge beard. And who screwed

Aaron

00:08:52 – 00:08:58

over Conan? What was the Conan story? Did was Conan trying to take Leno's spot and then they screwed him over?

Ian

00:08:58 – 00:09:08

I think Conan was in a similar boat where he wanted the whatever. Yeah. I think he became the Letterman. So I think he took over the 12:30 slot at some point. Maybe not right after Letterman.

Ian

00:09:08 – 00:09:15

I'm not sure. And then he didn't get the slot. And so then he went to, like, TBS or wherever.

Aaron

00:09:15 – 00:09:40

TBS and then showed someone else. Yeah. I just remember when he got screwed over, he had a great, like, short speech about not giving in to cynicism and stuff like that. I remember him doing like, he was objectively wronged, and he handled it very, he took the high road. And it seems like, you know, he doesn't have a, you know, a big three show, but it seems like he's crushing it with Conan Needs a Friend, which I've never listened to.

Ian

00:09:40 – 00:09:42

This is podcast. Podcast? Yeah.

Aaron

00:09:42 – 00:09:47

I I I understand that he's doing well. I I don't I have not experienced it, but

Ian

00:09:47 – 00:09:56

I've never been a Conan guy. I mean, I think he's fine. Like Conan love Conan. The only thing I even know about Conan is when he does the dog bit, and I like the dog bit. The dog bit is very funny.

Ian

00:09:56 – 00:10:02

That little whatever. The hand dog guy thing. The cigars. I like a dog that plays poker and smokes cigars, so that's very funny.

Aaron

00:10:02 – 00:10:03

You're a simple man.

Ian

00:10:03 – 00:10:08

I'm a simple man. But, yeah, that that's all I know about Conan. Like, because I think he was that guy

Aaron

00:10:08 – 00:10:13

You're telling me this dog plays poker? I'm in. You son of a bitch. I'm in.

Ian

00:10:15 – 00:10:16

I got Letterman. I don't need I don't need

Aaron

00:10:16 – 00:10:17

soda.

Ian

00:10:17 – 00:10:22

That's the thing. Then now it's all gone. Great. All we got is spaghetti and ketchup. We got nothing.

Ian

00:10:22 – 00:10:24

You don't even know what that means. You probably never seen gazellas.

Aaron

00:10:24 – 00:10:27

Nah. I don't know what that means. Anyway Sorry.

Ian

00:10:27 – 00:10:34

We don't have any good this was bothering me about this bothers me all the time about my children too. It's like they don't have any shared anything. Like, they're gonna be I know.

Aaron

00:10:34 – 00:10:35

They're gonna grow up and

Ian

00:10:35 – 00:10:45

be like, oh, did you watch pony lover 74? And their friends are gonna be like, no. I watched pony lover 72. I don't even know who's pony lover 74 is. And, like, there's no, like, Seinfeld.

Ian

00:10:45 – 00:10:49

There's no Agree. Central centralized culture

Aaron

00:10:49 – 00:10:50

I agree.

Ian

00:10:50 – 00:10:52

Which is all the problem in America in general.

Aaron

00:10:52 – 00:10:54

It's most of the problems. I'll agree. Yeah.

Ian

00:10:54 – 00:10:59

It's most of the problems. About anything. Right? There's only, like, you have your politics. Yeah.

Ian

00:10:59 – 00:11:02

And then you have nothing else shared because there's no shared culture.

Aaron

00:11:02 – 00:11:09

That's right. You've got you've got politics. You've got, which social media platform you're on. That's it. That's all we can talk about.

Aaron

00:11:09 – 00:11:14

There's nothing else. It's terrible. Oh, goodness gracious.

Ian

00:11:14 – 00:11:14

I do agree.

Aaron

00:11:14 – 00:11:19

Well, I'm glad you have, this shirt on. That's really great for letterman.

Ian

00:11:19 – 00:11:24

Yeah. Your letterman swag. Just release the swag, so you gotta you gotta buy some. Go buy some if you like letterman.

Aaron

00:11:24 – 00:11:26

I'm not gonna do that, but I'm happy for you.

Ian

00:11:26 – 00:11:26

Have to.

Aaron

00:11:26 – 00:11:27

I don't mean you.

Ian

00:11:27 – 00:11:29

I mean the, rhetorical you or the,

Aaron

00:11:29 – 00:11:34

speaking of dogs playing poker and smoking cigars, you've been playing some poker.

Ian

00:11:34 – 00:11:37

I've been on this fairly regular Friday afternoon game.

Aaron

00:11:37 – 00:11:40

Hourly wage of a on playing poker. Time. You're doing well.

Ian

00:11:40 – 00:11:42

Well, you know, let me tell you something.

Aaron

00:11:42 – 00:11:43

Yeah. Tell me.

Ian

00:11:43 – 00:11:53

As a gambler Uh-oh. I am a strong believer in, jinxes Yep. And things of that nature. Right?

Aaron

00:11:53 – 00:11:53

Mhmm.

Ian

00:11:54 – 00:12:00

So I jinxed myself. I went. I made a social media post about, look how well I'm doing.

Aaron

00:12:00 – 00:12:01

I've got some good stuff.

Ian

00:12:02 – 00:12:06

Yep. Of course, I lost Friday. Of course. There's inevitable. All one

Aaron

00:12:06 – 00:12:07

game. That.

Ian

00:12:07 – 00:12:07

Did you

Aaron

00:12:07 – 00:12:08

post that? To I did I

Ian

00:12:08 – 00:12:10

did say I lost. Yes.

Aaron

00:12:10 – 00:12:12

Balance is Yeah. Yeah. Balance is

Ian

00:12:12 – 00:12:23

People were following along. I was, like, posting pictures. It was, like, a little thing. I did I mean, it was, like, three in the morning or something, so I don't know who saw my follow-up that I lost. Our completionist, they would have, seen it.

Ian

00:12:24 – 00:12:24

And I do love

Aaron

00:12:24 – 00:12:25

a completionist.

Ian

00:12:26 – 00:12:26

I love a

Aaron

00:12:26 – 00:12:32

Do you have a sense of lifetime winnings or losing? You think you're up and down?

Ian

00:12:32 – 00:12:39

Oh, definitely up. I don't you know, I switched apps over the years, and there was a phase I didn't track it at all because I

Aaron

00:12:39 – 00:12:40

was like Mhmm. Don't

Ian

00:12:40 – 00:12:55

really care. Then, like, this for most of 2024, I didn't play at all. But, yeah, no. I'm up. I'm like, I'm probably at, like, I don't know, probably, like, 15 big blinds an hour, which is a really good rate.

Ian

00:12:55 – 00:13:07

Maybe it's 12, something like that. But, like so that's, like, normally how you think about it. It's like, okay. The size game you play, like, if you play Mhmm. $5 big blind, like, how many big blinds do you do you win in an hour?

Ian

00:13:07 – 00:13:12

Because this way you compare even across, like I see. Different stakes. Right? Because, like, if you

Aaron

00:13:12 – 00:13:14

have relatively Yeah.

Ian

00:13:14 – 00:13:21

Keeps it relative. Like, you might play one, two, or five five, or ten ten. Like, the amounts of money are quite different in all those. But yeah. No.

Ian

00:13:21 – 00:13:34

I think I could make a living as a poker player, I feel like. Wow. Not not not for my current life. But if I was, like, a single guy, right, and I didn't have a wife, I didn't make kids, like, could I survive? You could eke out.

Aaron

00:13:34 – 00:13:35

You could eke out a living.

Ian

00:13:35 – 00:13:40

Out a living. Yes. I could, like, just be a professional poker player. I feel like I could do that.

Aaron

00:13:40 – 00:13:47

Man, pity we're not in the eke out days anymore. You know? We gotta do a little we gotta do, like, quadruple ekes to make it these days.

Ian

00:13:47 – 00:13:58

Bike is yeah. If I was, like, in college now, you know, and I was like, hey. Instead of working at Office Depot or little corner store, I, I just play poker on the weekends as kinda, like, my my money. I

Aaron

00:13:59 – 00:14:04

This was also not no. Just for just for the record.

Ian

00:14:05 – 00:14:16

Yeah. But then you that that's a whole different approach. Like, I would play different games. You have there's a lot of different strategies if you're trying to make a living versus if it's, like, half entertainment, half Mhmm. For profits.

Ian

00:14:18 – 00:14:26

You know, you also have to be more cautious. You can't, like, you know, if you have a really bad session, that actually hurts you quite badly if this is all your money and your income Right.

Aaron

00:14:26 – 00:14:27

If this is your income.

Ian

00:14:27 – 00:14:43

Yeah. Versus if this is like, well, I don't care. Cause like, this is my entertainment and over the course of my life, I'm up. So it's like entertainment that pays me. And I don't necessarily care if like in the short term I'm down because it's not affecting my financial situation at all.

Ian

00:14:43 – 00:14:55

Whereas, if it was my only income, then, of course, it would potentially affect my financial situation. So, yeah, you have to have more bankroll, like, dedicated to poker, and you have to have a whole there's a whole different set of strategies if you are making a living on it.

Aaron

00:14:56 – 00:15:00

I'm just gonna keep selling database courses. That sounds way yeah. Sounds way easier.

Ian

00:15:02 – 00:15:08

It's probably a good strategy. It's a good strategy. Are you gambling, man? You gamble at all?

Aaron

00:15:09 – 00:15:15

No. Okay. No. I I have I've played some blackjack. Enjoy it a lot.

Aaron

00:15:15 – 00:15:20

Okay. So much fun. There we go. Gone gone to WinStar, which is north. It's just across the border in Oklahoma.

Aaron

00:15:21 – 00:15:45

Mhmm. Gone to WinStar a ton, especially, like, you know, when I was 18, 19, 20. Me and my best friend would, we would both come back home from college to Dallas, and then we would drive up to WinStar. We'd, like you know, we'd leave here. We'd leave Dallas at, like, nine or 10:00 at night, which at this point but I'm thirty minutes to an hour into into my slumber at this point.

Aaron

00:15:46 – 00:16:04

But in college, you know, we would we would drive through Taco Bell, drive up to Oklahoma Good. Gamble for a while. I would lose probably, like clockwork. I would lose $200, and my friend would either make a thousand or lose a thousand. It was a little more it was a little more wild than I was.

Aaron

00:16:04 – 00:16:14

Mhmm. And then the, either the biggest winner or the smallest loser on the way home would have to buy a Taco Cabana for the other person. You know, we're coming home at, like, three or four in the morning.

Ian

00:16:14 – 00:16:18

Oh, that's okay. You're not spending the night. This is just not up and back. Broke for that. Yeah.

Aaron

00:16:18 – 00:16:31

Yeah. So we'd come home, eat some taco sea, and then crash at somebody. So whoever was closest crash at their house. And it was just, man, so much fun going to win star. So much fun, especially because you get free sodas.

Aaron

00:16:32 – 00:16:36

You're just walking around. You get so I was just pounding sodas. It was so awesome.

Ian

00:16:36 – 00:16:43

18 there then, I think. Yeah. Look at that. Mhmm. I thought that this is oh, I thought it was pretty far.

Ian

00:16:43 – 00:16:45

Isn't it far from Dallas or no?

Aaron

00:16:46 – 00:16:50

It probably took us an hour and a half. Oh, that's it. Oh, I thought it was four

Ian

00:16:50 – 00:16:52

hours for some reason. No. No. No. No.

Ian

00:16:52 – 00:16:53

Oh, okay. Oh, that's not too bad then.

Aaron

00:16:54 – 00:16:55

No. It's not too bad at all.

Ian

00:16:55 – 00:17:00

Texas doesn't even have any casinos. What's up? I thought land of the free, home of the brave. Zero casinos.

Aaron

00:17:00 – 00:17:02

It is. I don't know. Literally zero.

Ian

00:17:02 – 00:17:03

I don't know. Makes no sense.

Aaron

00:17:03 – 00:17:15

I don't get it either. And the ones the ones in, Oklahoma are the Indian reservation ones. Right. And those are just right across the border. But I don't know why Texas hasn't legalized any sort of any sort of gambling.

Ian

00:17:16 – 00:17:21

Which. I mean, for Dallas, that's not too bad. But if you're in, like, Houston, that's a haul from Houston to go to. If

Aaron

00:17:21 – 00:17:25

you're in Houston, you're probably going over to. New Orleans or. Louisiana. Yeah.

Ian

00:17:25 – 00:17:27

Yeah. Yeah. It's got to be

Aaron

00:17:27 – 00:17:32

an hour, right? Oh, definitely. Yeah. Not close. Yeah.

Aaron

00:17:32 – 00:17:38

I don't know. I don't know. But I've seen I've seen a lot of these, like, sports betting things,

Ian

00:17:39 – 00:17:39

and

Aaron

00:17:39 – 00:17:52

some of the aftermath of it. And I'm I'm pretty I think I'm pretty down on gambling as becoming, like, a state sanctioned institution. Doesn't seem doesn't seem like something we want to be exposing to the masses.

Ian

00:17:52 – 00:17:54

Does Texas have lotto?

Aaron

00:17:54 – 00:17:56

Texas does have a lotto. Yes.

Ian

00:17:56 – 00:18:03

See, this is the thing, though. This is why casinos get a very bad rap to me because, first of all, you have sports betting on your phone, which is way worse than a casino.

Aaron

00:18:03 – 00:18:04

Way worse. Casino, you have to

Ian

00:18:04 – 00:18:09

literally go there I agree. And do it, and there's security, and there's people watching, and there's

Aaron

00:18:09 – 00:18:18

And you're handing over US dollars from your hand. Yes. Yeah. Sports betting on the phone, way worse. Way worse.

Ian

00:18:18 – 00:18:21

Twenty four hours a day. Seven days is way worse. Nightmare.

Aaron

00:18:21 – 00:18:30

Just completely should be regulated. I hate, you know, big government, but big government has gotta save us here. Yeah. You gotta step in and say no more sports gambling.

Ian

00:18:30 – 00:18:43

And then you got lotto, which is like again, it's very much like this tax on the poor to me. It's like Very much. In your five dollars, and you're gonna win the lotto and be a millionaire if you're not going to. And then who knows where that money goes? Right?

Ian

00:18:43 – 00:18:45

It's all like, it's for the school.

Aaron

00:18:45 – 00:18:56

Fund schools, which is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Here's the problem. Here's the problem with sports betting is everybody knows a guy who's made a bunch on sports betting. Nobody knows anybody that's ever won the lottery. Right.

Aaron

00:18:56 – 00:19:03

And so you hear, like, oh, the lottery is a billion dollars. You're like, man, not for me. But you hear, like, oh, this guy this guy knows somebody

Ian

00:19:03 – 00:19:03

with tip.

Aaron

00:19:04 – 00:19:12

Just get injured, and and he made $20,000 in the game last week. You're like, yeah. I'm gonna do it. And then you're destitute. You gambled away your family's money.

Ian

00:19:12 – 00:19:24

So this is my whole thing. I think casinos are by the humans are gonna want to have their vices, and the casinos are the best form of the vices vices compared to some of these alternatives in some ways. They also have physical structure.

Aaron

00:19:25 – 00:19:32

Just change your vices into virtues. Whenever you wanna go gamble, go read a book instead. Problem solved. So America is healed. We're fixed.

Aaron

00:19:33 – 00:19:38

We're back. That's the worst advice I've ever had. That's a great idea. This is worse than your blue sky take.

Ian

00:19:38 – 00:19:39

This might be your worst take.

Aaron

00:19:39 – 00:19:44

No. This is my best take. Okay. Instead of reboot, go build something. Go make something awesome.

Ian

00:19:44 – 00:19:46

You can't do that all day long. You gotta have some help.

Aaron

00:19:46 – 00:19:48

Can. You should. No. You can. You should.

Ian

00:19:48 – 00:19:49

Just get burned out. You gotta have

Aaron

00:19:49 – 00:19:56

some other things going. Nah. That's where digging tunnels come true. When you get burned out when you get burned out

Ian

00:19:56 – 00:19:56

Oh, yeah.

Aaron

00:19:56 – 00:20:00

Building stuff on the Internet, then then you dig tunnels. Mhmm. That's perfect.

Ian

00:20:02 – 00:20:08

I think you should go gamble. Get out there and gamble, but just be responsible. Only gamble within your means.

Aaron

00:20:08 – 00:20:10

This is why it's such a good show

Ian

00:20:10 – 00:20:11

because smartly

Aaron

00:20:11 – 00:20:17

That is the most insane thing I've that's the worst charge to the audience. I've never heard get out there and gamble.

Ian

00:20:17 – 00:20:27

No gamble. First of all, if you do poker, you can actually just have an advantage and win. It's not even gambling. It's like you have a, a way to adjust the odds in your favor, which is not true of

Aaron

00:20:27 – 00:20:28

any of these other things.

Ian

00:20:28 – 00:20:48

And then even if you go gamble, you could be smart. Like you could do roulette, a single single zero roulette, which is like you're paying 1% or something, then you're gonna get free rooms. Then you're saving money on that. You're you're even if you just play some of these, more smarter games, if you just go play slot machine, you're getting destroyed. Like, you're paying 30%.

Ian

00:20:48 – 00:20:48

That's insane.

Aaron

00:20:49 – 00:20:53

It's not gambling if you have a system. That's what you're saying. I've got a system.

Ian

00:20:53 – 00:20:59

No. No. Not a system. Like well, okay. So my system is system.

Aaron

00:21:01 – 00:21:04

You just told me you don't have a system. Alright.

Ian

00:21:04 – 00:21:12

Alright. Here's the deal. There's people with, like, gambling systems, quote, unquote, which are, like, gonna take a game that is, like, mathematically, you cannot win at.

Aaron

00:21:12 – 00:21:13

Right.

Ian

00:21:13 – 00:21:16

And pretend that via some double my bet

Aaron

00:21:16 – 00:21:16

every time.

Ian

00:21:16 – 00:21:21

Right. That that that you can magically win, which is not true. You can't. That no. That's the problem.

Ian

00:21:21 – 00:21:34

But what you can do is okay. I can learn well how to play poker, in which case I now have an advantage over in the in the game. K. Plus in the game. Yep.

Ian

00:21:34 – 00:21:56

But to go play, you have these other expenses which cut into your advantage, like, a hotel room, which could be expensive at casino 3 or $400 or whatever. Right. So if you play the games, they want you to play, which are the games that you can't win at, but you do that smartly. Then what happens is you get the rooms for free. Okay.

Ian

00:21:56 – 00:22:13

And you are not paying them anywhere near the value of the room. And now this is adding to your advantage in the post, because you are not paying for this room cost. The rooms are now free to you. And that's a huge savings, which normally would be a tax on your poker winnings.

Aaron

00:22:14 – 00:22:14

Now it's

Ian

00:22:14 – 00:22:17

not a tax and maybe you're breaking even, you know, you're not gonna

Aaron

00:22:20 – 00:22:20

be again, you can't win at that, but you can break even or

Ian

00:22:20 – 00:22:27

close to it if you play the right games. And so now that's a wash, and you win at poker. So you're plus.

Aaron

00:22:27 – 00:22:35

So you're saying go go lose a hundred dollars at one of the dumb games. Get a $500 room for free Gotcha. And then go make a bunch of money on poker.

Ian

00:22:35 – 00:22:36

No. You're speaking my language.

Aaron

00:22:37 – 00:22:39

Okay. Alright. That's interesting. That's interesting.

Ian

00:22:39 – 00:22:40

There we go.

Aaron

00:22:40 – 00:22:41

That's not great. Once you win is interesting.

Ian

00:22:42 – 00:23:09

We'll get you playing a little poker. It's gonna be fine. Ever wish your PHP stand analysis could be supercharged with AI powered code reviews? Meet CodeRabbit, the AI native code review platform that works alongside PHP stand to revolutionize your PHP development workflow. Beyond static analysis, CodeRabbit analyzes pull requests to provide instant PR summaries, in-depth code walkthroughs with sequence diagrams, and one click suggestions to improve your code.

Ian

00:23:10 – 00:23:48

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Ian

00:23:49 – 00:23:50

Thanks again to code rabbit.

Aaron

00:23:50 – 00:23:55

I got a lot of stuff to do when I retire, but we can we can add that to the list.

Ian

00:23:55 – 00:24:02

What do you wanna do when you retire? What's your number one? Or you and the wife? I don't know if you have a shared idea. Do you have a shared plan?

Aaron

00:24:02 – 00:24:03

I don't I don't know.

Ian

00:24:03 – 00:24:05

You haven't thought about I mean, coming on that deep yet?

Aaron

00:24:05 – 00:24:11

I can't think that far. Honestly, what I wanna do when I retire is tinker with hobby electronics. That's as far as I've gotten.

Ian

00:24:11 – 00:24:12

Oh, hobby electronics.

Aaron

00:24:12 – 00:24:17

Okay. That's kind of that's kind of as far as I've gotten. Rob little robots and stuff.

Ian

00:24:17 – 00:24:20

A workshop. Some kind of workshop situation.

Aaron

00:24:21 – 00:24:43

Yes. I want to have I want to have, like, a, basically, a a warehouse with big windows Yep. Like a factory where I have a bunch of tools, and I can go in there and build stuff and make stuff. I'll probably honestly, if if YouTube is still a thing, I would totally be a 50 year old YouTuber

Ian

00:24:43 – 00:24:43

Yeah.

Aaron

00:24:43 – 00:24:48

Making in in the workshop. Oh, man. That would be awesome. I would love that.

Ian

00:24:48 – 00:24:52

You're you're optimistic you're gonna be retired by 50 with these four kids.

Aaron

00:24:52 – 00:24:58

No. I'm gonna be retired by, like, '42. That's you know, it's so funny. I used to say this exact same thing. It's so it's so different.

Aaron

00:24:58 – 00:24:59

It's different. It's different.

Ian

00:24:59 – 00:25:00

We started the business. I was like, 35. I'm done.

Aaron

00:25:00 – 00:25:02

Then I hit 35, and I was like, 45.

Ian

00:25:02 – 00:25:06

I'm done. 45. I'm like, 55. I'm done.

Aaron

00:25:06 – 00:25:12

It's different. I'll be I'll be out. I'll be I'll be out by how old will I be? Let's see. I'm 35 now.

Ian

00:25:12 – 00:25:14

There's zero chance you're out.

Aaron

00:25:15 – 00:25:31

42. I think I could I think I could be, not post economic. You know, I'm not going full photo map, but I think I could be I think I could be optional work by 45, 10 years from now.

Ian

00:25:31 – 00:25:37

Well, okay. Are we saying, like, do you have other income that might come to you? Do you have wealthy family?

Aaron

00:25:37 – 00:25:38

I mean, I don't wanna get that deep in it.

Ian

00:25:38 – 00:25:45

But if you have stuff like that, obviously, that changes the equation. Right? No. Okay. Do you think just by 45, you'll be right?

Aaron

00:25:45 – 00:25:45

By '45

Ian

00:25:46 – 00:25:46

Ten years.

Aaron

00:25:47 – 00:25:48

My own bootstraps

Ian

00:25:49 – 00:25:49

Okay.

Aaron

00:25:49 – 00:25:52

Ten years, I think I could be I think I could be free.

Ian

00:25:52 – 00:25:54

I mean, I thought, like, literally impossible.

Aaron

00:25:54 – 00:25:56

Of course not. It's gonna happen.

Ian

00:25:56 – 00:26:00

It's gonna be very, very difficult. Alright. We got these four kids. I don't know if you're aware of that.

Aaron

00:26:00 – 00:26:02

Somebody somebody write it down. Somebody set a reminder for ten years

Ian

00:26:02 – 00:26:08

to run. If you do it. That'll be awesome. I'm I don't wanna send negative energy your way. I'm just saying, like, a lot of expenses along the way.

Aaron

00:26:08 – 00:26:10

Boy, isn't it?

Ian

00:26:10 – 00:26:20

Yeah. And then the real thing too is, like, there's the expense along the way, but then there's how you wanna live after, like, you wanna have your electronics workshop. You wanna buy expensive electronic parts for your

Aaron

00:26:20 – 00:26:21

electronics workshop.

Ian

00:26:21 – 00:26:29

Like, you're not trying to be like, okay, I'm on this really tight budget. And like, I got enough money for the bread and, and my seltzers, and I'm good. Like, you wanna have enough to deal

Aaron

00:26:29 – 00:26:30

with you and stuff. Yeah.

Ian

00:26:30 – 00:26:31

You don't wanna eke it out. I don't

Aaron

00:26:31 – 00:26:32

wanna eke it out.

Ian

00:26:32 – 00:26:33

Children and,

Aaron

00:26:33 – 00:26:34

you know, time. No. No. No. No.

Aaron

00:26:34 – 00:26:35

No. No.

Ian

00:26:35 – 00:26:37

So that does add a lot to the number. It's gonna

Aaron

00:26:37 – 00:26:38

be it's gonna be a big decade.

Ian

00:26:39 – 00:26:40

It's gonna be a big decade.

Aaron

00:26:40 – 00:26:49

We're gonna have to do. We got a lot to do. Feel it in my bones. We got a lot to do. I will say we, we had our first not our first.

Aaron

00:26:49 – 00:26:53

We had our most recent meeting with our accountant the other day, me and Steve.

Ian

00:26:54 – 00:26:54

Okay. And

Aaron

00:26:54 – 00:26:57

we haven't taken any money out because it's like, well, have you done

Ian

00:26:58 – 00:26:59

Are you using my accountant or no?

Aaron

00:26:59 – 00:27:02

No. Okay. We're using one Steve had.

Ian

00:27:02 – 00:27:03

Okay.

Aaron

00:27:03 – 00:27:09

Like, wanted to make sure we got the s election. We're an LLC electing to be taxed as an s corp.

Ian

00:27:09 – 00:27:09

We wanted

Aaron

00:27:09 – 00:27:29

to make sure that we got, like, all of that squared away before we started moving money around because they don't wanna accidentally get hosed. And Yeah. We had the meeting with the accountant, and Steve sent over some numbers ahead of time. And on the call, the accountant was like, you know, when Steve told me the idea for this, I was like, oh, that's,

Ian

00:27:29 – 00:27:30

you know,

Aaron

00:27:30 – 00:27:40

that's a nice idea. And then Steve sent the numbers over today, and I was really impressed. And I was like, yes, we got the account. We got the the accountants impressed. She likes us.

Aaron

00:27:40 – 00:27:47

So that felt really, really good. And we took some distributions, so we have money now. Yeah.

Ian

00:27:47 – 00:27:48

Oh, you haven't been taking distribution?

Aaron

00:27:49 – 00:27:52

No. I haven't taken a single dollar since we started this thing.

Ian

00:27:52 – 00:27:53

Wow. Okay.

Aaron

00:27:53 – 00:27:59

Yeah. So Interesting. Yeah. Not great. So now we're set up on we're set up on payroll.

Aaron

00:27:59 – 00:28:15

So with the s corp, as you know, you do part payroll, part distribution. So Mhmm. We're set up on payroll, got all that squared away for what a reasonable person would expect to get paid. And then we just took some some big old distributions. It's like, we'll get taxed on it anyway.

Aaron

00:28:15 – 00:28:16

Let's just take it out.

Ian

00:28:16 – 00:28:17

Yeah. You gotta take it out.

Aaron

00:28:17 – 00:28:18

People don't take it out. Like, take it out. What do you

Ian

00:28:19 – 00:28:19

it doesn't You're

Aaron

00:28:19 – 00:28:21

gonna pay the taxes. Doesn't matter.

Ian

00:28:21 – 00:28:34

Like, yes. It doesn't matter. It's not affecting. You might as well take it out, and then you can invest it or do whatever you're gonna do with it. Like, there's no you gotta leave enough in there to run the operations, but there's no point in keeping a lot above that.

Ian

00:28:34 – 00:28:35

No. Because No.

Aaron

00:28:36 – 00:28:39

So that feels good. Big milestone. Big milestone in there.

Ian

00:28:39 – 00:28:41

Congratulations. Love the distribution.

Aaron

00:28:41 – 00:28:42

Love a distribution.

Ian

00:28:43 – 00:28:56

Is it interesting little aspect to that for you? Because, like, with the partner, it's, like, more of a conversation. You know? You have to, like, figure out, like, when you're gonna do it, how much you're gonna do, and all that kind of stuff. So Yeah.

Ian

00:28:57 – 00:28:59

Cool. So that's good. Money in the bank. We are

Aaron

00:28:59 – 00:29:04

Money in the bank. Money off the ball. Money from try hard bank to Aaron Bank is always a good day.

Ian

00:29:05 – 00:29:10

Very good. Very good. Alright. Well, you're underway then. Underway to retirement.

Ian

00:29:10 – 00:29:12

Put the count. Somebody's gotta build a little flipper countdown.

Aaron

00:29:12 – 00:29:18

That's right. Yeah. Somebody said I don't know if there's a long term reminder service, but somebody said a ten year reminder to check back in.

Ian

00:29:19 – 00:29:19

There probably is.

Aaron

00:29:19 – 00:29:27

So that when I'm 45, I'll be super depressed when I get that reminder that I'm supposed to be retired. Oh, man. No. I don't know.

Ian

00:29:28 – 00:29:56

I'm just I'm just gonna say, I think it, like, I don't think it was good for me that I had that mindset. That would be my advice to you. I think it was bad to have that mindset, generally. I think it, like, creates these expectations that are probably not achievable, really. And so at least at again, at the level, like, I think you're probably gonna wanna do things along the way for the kids, all the stuff, the underground garage, for example, the stuff like that.

Aaron

00:29:58 – 00:30:00

All that stuff. That cuts into the timeline a little bit.

Ian

00:30:00 – 00:30:07

Cuts in a little bit. So I don't know. Do you even wanna be retired? This is a whole other thing. It's like, oh, retired.

Ian

00:30:07 – 00:30:07

Quit

Aaron

00:30:07 – 00:30:08

working. No.

Ian

00:30:08 – 00:30:20

But that's the thing. It's like, if you're retired, it's like to have the amount of money that you could really be like, I just fly around, and I just do all kinds of crazy shit. Anywhere. An insane amount of money. Right?

Aaron

00:30:20 – 00:30:21

So, like wanna stay at home.

Ian

00:30:21 – 00:30:30

You're gonna have to really have a mega home run, you know, to do that. So let's say okay. Let's say that's a very outsized Let's

Aaron

00:30:30 – 00:30:47

give it a number. What do you think the number is for just, like, a normal I don't wanna I don't wanna go to Ibiza or anything. Like, what's the normal I'm I'm retired. I could work if I want to and maintain a maintain, like, a nice urban Dallas life lifestyle.

Ian

00:30:47 – 00:30:50

Okay. So yeah. So not the, like, you're flying private jets around.

Aaron

00:30:50 – 00:30:52

No. Just I'm never flying private jets.

Ian

00:30:52 – 00:30:55

Retired, but, like, all the kids go to the school you want them

Aaron

00:30:55 – 00:31:05

to go to college. Let's say to They're not they're not going to Harvard or Yale or anything. They're going to Texas a and m Yeah. Whatever. Somebody somewhere like that.

Aaron

00:31:05 – 00:31:06

I mean, I don't know.

Ian

00:31:06 – 00:31:19

I mean, to retire at 45, you're adding a lot of years before the normal retirement age too. Right? And so you're also, like, not gonna whatever. It's cutting into your Social Security when you do get to 65. Like, there's a lot of factors, but I don't know.

Ian

00:31:19 – 00:31:31

I mean, it's gotta be at least, like, for you like, listen. This is not a number for, like this is the number for I think you wanna live, like, with foot now. It's gotta be at least I mean, it's gotta be at least a minimum, like, 10,000,000.

Aaron

00:31:31 – 00:31:36

That's what I was thinking. 10. Yeah. That's exactly what I was thinking. $10,000,000.

Ian

00:31:36 – 00:31:46

And I think that the way you wanna live, it could be it could be tight because you have twenty years before you're 65 at that point where you're gonna be spending money with, like, government security and all kinds of stuff.

Aaron

00:31:46 – 00:31:48

I'm not getting any I'm not getting a dime from the government.

Ian

00:31:48 – 00:31:52

That's a Elon's in there now. Like, he said you're gonna have to suffer some hardship.

Aaron

00:31:52 – 00:32:01

So He's gonna go shut up. So we'll we'll be rich again. But I'm I'm I'm People will be rich. I'm counting on getting from that. $0 from the government.

Ian

00:32:01 – 00:32:05

Well, so that's fine. Even That's fine. Well, I don't know if that's fine. But, yes, that's

Aaron

00:32:05 – 00:32:06

I'm okay

Ian

00:32:06 – 00:32:13

with that. Yeah. So yeah. So, I mean I mean, that's like okay. So let's say you live to 85.

Ian

00:32:13 – 00:32:15

Right? And so that's, like

Aaron

00:32:15 – 00:32:23

10,000,000. 40 years. That's 25,000,000. They say the first million is the hardest. So, hopefully, after I hit one, it'll be easier.

Ian

00:32:24 – 00:32:30

Well well, I mean, because you gotta also factor it now. I guess if we mean, I'm I was saying 10,000,000 after tax. But if you wanna Yeah.

Aaron

00:32:30 – 00:32:32

10,000,000. 10 million in the bank.

Ian

00:32:33 – 00:32:43

Yeah. 10,000,000 in the bank. Right? So now you're talking about 15,000,000, you know, roughly, let's say 14,000,000, 15 million. Which, I mean, it's not impossible.

Ian

00:32:44 – 00:32:46

But then alright. So that's $250,000 a year

Aaron

00:32:47 – 00:32:50

for forty years. What's $250,000 a year?

Ian

00:32:51 – 00:32:51

10,000,000.

Aaron

00:32:51 – 00:32:52

Then I can draw that out.

Ian

00:32:52 – 00:32:59

40. Yeah. Got it. That that now obviously you could, like, invest the 10,000,000 you're making interest. So whatever the comp, right?

Ian

00:32:59 – 00:33:25

The calculation gets what more complicated. So do you actually need 10,000,000? Maybe again, if you're playing it tight and like kids' activities, kids' colleges, like those things, like, yeah, if it's state school, if it's they're not into any crazy activities, like, yeah, you could probably do it with even less as long as you're being frugal about it. And, obviously, lots of people do it with less. This is one of these conversations where, like, that sound ridiculous.

Ian

00:33:25 – 00:33:34

Right? Like, of course, it's possible to do it less. But the the caveat here is for the lifestyle you want to live Correct. You wanna have a warehouse with a electronics factory in it. Right?

Ian

00:33:34 – 00:33:37

Like, that's not normal retirement living.

Aaron

00:33:37 – 00:33:37

Right.

Ian

00:33:37 – 00:33:46

Yes. So that's that's the rub. Yeah. But not impossible. It's, if you're if you're frugal ish along the way,

Aaron

00:33:46 – 00:33:52

I think it's too old. So we're we're gonna have to we're gonna have to amp it up just a little bit. Well, the thing is

Ian

00:33:52 – 00:34:09

it just creates a a combination of, like, a, you're still gonna be very young, and what are you gonna do anyway? You're probably gonna wanna do stuff. So, like, there's retired and there's retired. There's retired, like, you literally don't work anymore. And then there's retired, like Yeah.

Ian

00:34:09 – 00:34:22

I don't build courses, and I'm not trying to build a SaaS, but maybe I still have my YouTube channel. And I'm doing stuff, and I'm still making my you know what I mean? Like, there's all the layers to it. So that's the other other kind of thing.

Aaron

00:34:22 – 00:34:27

Well, I'll keep you posted. There we go. 10,000,000 10 million is a lot. Should we put a

Ian

00:34:27 – 00:34:32

$10,000,000 counter up and you could Yeah. In real time. Let us know.

Aaron

00:34:32 – 00:34:38

I gotta get I gotta get to one before I get to 10, and we're struggling there, but we'll make it. We'll get there. We're we've only just begun.

Ian

00:34:39 – 00:34:41

Yeah. Here we go. I don't know how

Aaron

00:34:41 – 00:34:42

many ads there are.

Ian

00:34:45 – 00:34:55

Alright. What else we got? I don't know. People wanna like, literally, like, seven or eight people messaged me about wanting to hear about the HubSpot back office. So should we go through the HubSpot back office?

Aaron

00:34:55 – 00:35:04

Let's go through the back office. Tell me. I got I love I love a back office. That's what I spent that's what I spent five years doing at the property tax company. Back office is great.

Aaron

00:35:04 – 00:35:06

Tell us about the back office.

Ian

00:35:07 – 00:35:26

So the back office is HubSpot is before Stripe. HubSpot is before all these platforms that we use now that take care of money for you. Right? So the only way to collect money was to build your own thing. And then even, like, you can use this thing called authorize.net, which was, like, the thing before Stripe, which was really bad.

Ian

00:35:26 – 00:35:47

It wasn't even anything really like Stripe. It was, like, real credit card processor that sort of did this online thing and whatever. So version one of the back office was like, okay, like people sign up, they gotta get a license file, because this is only downloadable product and we gotta collect money from them somehow. So this tool does that. And that's what it did.

Ian

00:35:47 – 00:36:07

And that's pretty much what it does now. So the thing is we could have moved to Stripe sort of at some point along the way, but we have all these, like, legacy customers that are in older license tiles that Stripe doesn't really support. There's probably some way today to do it, but it's like, do we go through all that work to like move everything? No, I don't

Aaron

00:36:08 – 00:36:08

think so.

Ian

00:36:11 – 00:36:37

So yeah. So what the back office does is like when you sign up for HubSpot, you actually sign up in this back office app that now does all kinds of other stuff. It collects your information, of course, but then, like, if you're signing up for a cloud account, it like kicks off a thing that builds a server and AWS for you and does all the connections and all kinds of stuff. It sets up for you and sets up help slot, does all that stuff. It has this whole management arm of all the cloud servers.

Ian

00:36:37 – 00:37:01

So like manages all the cloud servers and their deployment ability and upgrading help slot versions and security stuff, and you're on a custom domain as opposed to the domain we give you and all those type of things, like SSL certificates for that and all that stuff. There's all this management logic in there, and in combined with other systems. But that's, like, one of the things. It's like a CRM. It's got all the customer data.

Ian

00:37:01 – 00:37:16

It's got, those invoices. It does coupon codes. Does all that financial stuff. And then does reports. So it has, you know, I have, like, a projections report for, like, upcoming renewals.

Ian

00:37:16 – 00:37:19

It has historical sales. It has

Aaron

00:37:19 – 00:37:21

Oh, so, like, accounting reports.

Ian

00:37:21 – 00:37:50

Accounting reports. It has sales tax reports, like, how much sales tax did we collect in the states we collect sales tax in, accounts receivable, because we do invoicing, which is somebody all you out there don't do this anymore, but you should at least consider it because a lot of companies still like to pay by invoice and check and transfer. We support that, and this tool supports that. None of those some, like, email stuff. Just looking at the list of stuff it does.

Ian

00:37:50 – 00:37:57

It has, like, partner management for, like, partners who get a commission when they sell HubSpot, like, an affiliate system.

Aaron

00:37:58 – 00:38:12

Yeah. That's what it does. Like, that's So does it run all of this stuff? Like because when I was when I was doing this, we had, like, maybe a hundred different scheduled commands that would, like

Ian

00:38:12 – 00:38:12

Mhmm.

Aaron

00:38:12 – 00:38:31

Wake up and check the database for stuff and do stuff and go back to sleep. Some some every some every minute, some once a month, that sort of thing. And so it's like Yep. This back office just constantly running these processes all the time that are checking for things that need to be done or updated or stuff like that. Yep.

Ian

00:38:31 – 00:38:43

Yeah. So it does stuff like, most of that, is on, like, the money end of things, I believe. So it's like yeah. Like, it send us all these series of email, right? Like, for the different license types.

Ian

00:38:43 – 00:39:06

So, like, if you're on an older own license, it's like, well, your support renewal's coming due in ninety days, sixty days, thirty days today, all that stuff. If you're on a you know, it does the renewals for subscriptions. So okay. Today's the day that, like, this you know, these four companies need to resubscribe, so it does the subscription management. There's a lot of that stuff.

Ian

00:39:06 – 00:39:26

I think I don't know. I haven't built and don't know as much about the, like, cloud aspects of it, but I think there are some, like, scheduled things where it's checking things cloud wise for different things. So, yeah, there is that type of thing in there as well, just like stuff that needs to happen, on some kind of regular basis, and it does that stuff.

Aaron

00:39:27 – 00:39:37

That's my favorite that's my favorite thing, I think, to to code is, like, let's let's basically write process automation. That's

Ian

00:39:37 – 00:39:39

what I that's what I love

Aaron

00:39:40 – 00:39:57

love doing. It's like so back at the property tax company and actually went to their holiday their Christmas party on, on Friday. They still invite me. So it was so it was so wild to go and, like, not recognize. Like, I used to be in charge of everyone, and I go, and I don't recognize anybody anymore.

Ian

00:39:57 – 00:39:57

Who are these?

Aaron

00:39:58 – 00:40:07

So fun. But that was the kind of stuff that we did was like Mhmm. Alright. Somebody's gonna sign up and type in their address onto our site. Then Yeah.

Aaron

00:40:07 – 00:40:39

We're gonna generate a PDF. We're gonna send the, you know, the DocuSign to the person. After they sign it, we're gonna use their API to check if if it's been signed, then we're gonna send that PDF to the county, and then we're gonna check the county every hour until the county has, like, faithfully recognized that we are now the agent of record. And if they don't do it in, you know, seven days, we're gonna resend the forms over and over and over until they code us as the agent and, like, making it used to be that humans had to do all of that. Right.

Aaron

00:40:39 – 00:40:48

And now it's just the computer. And I love I absolutely love automating the processes and letting the humans do the higher creativity stuff. It's so fun.

Ian

00:40:48 – 00:41:05

That that is really cool. And that's, like, even yeah. We don't have anything quite like that where we have, like, other third party we other than Stripe, we don't well, to our own systems, we have other, interactions and integrations, but not to, like, the government or anything like that. So that's that's pretty cool. I like that.

Ian

00:41:05 – 00:41:20

Yeah. We do have, like, stuff like there's a lot of, like, weird edge case logic things. Because it's like, okay. Are you a subscription customer, which is, like, a new customers in the last twelve years, whatever? Or are you before that, so you're a grandfathered, like, owned licensed customer?

Ian

00:41:21 – 00:41:36

Okay. And then your invoice or subscription. Okay. And then if you're invoiced, like, do you have a purchase order that which is like a contract that people have when they buy things that that companies use? So if you have a purchase order, then we do certain things.

Ian

00:41:36 – 00:41:45

If you don't have a purchase order, then we do different things. And yeah. So there's that kind of stuff, that's in there. It's not, like, scheduled, but there are all logical edges to things.

Aaron

00:41:45 – 00:41:58

I bet your accounting your accounting arbiter, twenty years of edge cases baked into the logic that decides who to build what when. I bet that is wild.

Ian

00:41:58 – 00:42:26

Yeah. There's some weird stuff in there. And just because we have different models over the years, we even have, like, per user for, like, a minute way back before that. It was probably too early even that didn't work out So we got rid of that a subscription per user, which we're probably going back to here soon but it's obviously very common now where it wasn't, necessarily common back then so yeah, so, like, there's that's the worst stuff with this stuff, which everybody knows about this. So it's like, oh, you try try let's try this new pricing.

Ian

00:42:26 – 00:42:58

Oh, now we have eight customers on that new pricing, but it didn't really generally work out. So, like, let's stitch that. So now, like, these eight customers must be forever maintained in their weird pricing state or tell them to move, which is something I guess we could have done, but we didn't do in that particular case. So, yeah, there's just a lot of, like, stuff that's built up over time sort of thing in there, which is why it's, like, it's much better now because, it was just rebuilt in the last well, a year ago, it got finished. But But it took, like, a year to rebuild it.

Aaron

00:42:58 – 00:42:58

The back office is

Ian

00:42:58 – 00:43:06

just a fabrication. Yeah. Eric Oh. Just rebuilt that. It was, like, the last thing he did before he went full time on Marvel News, was rebuilt.

Aaron

00:43:06 – 00:43:08

Eric Barnes, he doesn't just play golf all day?

Ian

00:43:08 – 00:43:10

Yeah. You wouldn't have

Aaron

00:43:10 – 00:43:15

He actually programs because based based on what I see online, he's just golfing all day.

Ian

00:43:15 – 00:43:19

I'm I'm me I'm just gonna be a professional poker player. He's gonna be a professional golfer.

Aaron

00:43:19 – 00:43:25

Holy. I know. I gotta come I gotta come work at UserScape. That's the way I know. That's the way to do it.

Ian

00:43:25 – 00:43:28

That is the way. Then you go off and just chill.

Aaron

00:43:28 – 00:43:36

Then you go off and you get to either be Taylor, Eric, or Ian. That's awesome. That's the option. That's amazing. Oh, goodness.

Aaron

00:43:36 – 00:43:36

Yeah. I know. He does do a

Ian

00:43:36 – 00:43:56

lot of golfing. I don't know how he squares that circle, but, yes, he rebuilt it. So now it's like a modern Laravel app, which is much nicer and has all those niceties and proper cues and whatever test suite and blah blah blah blah. But this is the third, I think, iteration of it. Mhmm.

Ian

00:43:56 – 00:44:16

It was, like, my original terrible one. There was another terrible one I built very quickly before, like actually, right before I hired Taylor and Eric, just already a long time ago. I, like, was like the thing I first had was like unusable by anybody but me. So I was like, alright, let me like build something that at least makes some kind of sense. So I did that and then that's what we used.

Ian

00:44:17 – 00:44:32

And then that was like added on to over the years in a million crazy ways. That was nuts. And then Eric sat down and like properly thought through everything, how things actually work now and rebuilt it. So so that's good. So that's really nice to have that.

Ian

00:44:32 – 00:44:36

It's like all modern and Livewire and all the

Aaron

00:44:37 – 00:44:37

That's all Livewire.

Ian

00:44:38 – 00:44:42

Yeah. It uses Nice. Yeah. It's Livewire. There's some filament stuff in there.

Aaron

00:44:42 – 00:44:44

You're using flux for.

Ian

00:44:45 – 00:44:51

Well, I'm not using flux for that, but it's I'm not going back and ripping out the filament stuff. We use

Aaron

00:44:51 – 00:44:51

some

Ian

00:44:51 – 00:45:11

filament stuff in there because, like, whatever, it's a back office. But, I'm using filament on new help spot website, and I am using or not filament. Flux on new help spot website and Flux on some new HelpSpot inside of HelpSpot stuff that we'll be doing. So we'll be the flux will be being used heavily. So it's good to see.

Aaron

00:45:11 – 00:45:13

He's moving fast on the flux, man.

Ian

00:45:13 – 00:45:14

He's moving. I feel

Aaron

00:45:14 – 00:45:21

like I feel like every every day, I'm getting a new, I'm getting a new notes on work from Caleb about something else he's fixed.

Ian

00:45:21 – 00:45:23

Love the notes on work.

Aaron

00:45:23 – 00:45:24

He's moving.

Ian

00:45:24 – 00:45:33

I find it very intimidating. Like, I would like to do a notes on work type of thing, but I'm like, I don't produce at the pace. I would just be talking about the same thing for, like, three months. He's like, oh, yeah. I did this thing, and I did this thing, and I did this thing.

Aaron

00:45:33 – 00:45:41

Like, he's, like, he's on it. He's on to the next thing. I want I I'm gonna do a notes on work. I got a lot of I got a lot of thoughts, man. You tried this before with the video.

Aaron

00:45:41 – 00:45:42

Is it, like, the

Ian

00:45:42 – 00:45:43

the thing? Does it be next

Aaron

00:45:43 – 00:45:43

week? Yeah.

Ian

00:45:43 – 00:45:44

Yeah. Yeah. I'm gonna

Aaron

00:45:44 – 00:45:48

do it again. I'm going back. Video? Starts. We'll get there.

Aaron

00:45:49 – 00:45:50

Probably just audio.

Ian

00:45:51 – 00:45:51

Mhmm.

Aaron

00:45:52 – 00:45:54

There's not a lot to show. You know?

Ian

00:45:54 – 00:46:02

Yeah. So that that adds a lot to it too. Like, it does that adds a lot of burden to it whereas, like, audio, if you, like, make it real light, you could just be, like, in the car. You could be like

Aaron

00:46:03 – 00:46:03

Totally.

Ian

00:46:03 – 00:46:11

But, yeah, you could just, like, do it whenever as opposed to, like, well, video, you have to be, like, in your setup, and it was, like, a whole thing. And you have to edit it probably and, like, whatever, all that stuff.

Aaron

00:46:11 – 00:46:12

Yeah.

Ian

00:46:14 – 00:46:17

Yeah. I know. But then maybe it's just like he just has a vibe for it. You know? I don't know.

Ian

00:46:17 – 00:46:24

He's got he's got a vibe for it. Vibe. Maybe he wouldn't. Maybe I don't know. Maybe he it's a special sort of, thing.

Ian

00:46:24 – 00:46:36

It is hard to talk to yourself, like It is. Without somebody to bounce off of. Like, there are awkward moments. I did have a podcast like that a long time ago. And I was like, I think I got, like, 10 episodes in, and I was like, yeah.

Ian

00:46:36 – 00:46:37

It's just me.

Aaron

00:46:37 – 00:46:38

You had a solo show?

Ian

00:46:38 – 00:46:41

It was quasi solo. It was, anything but code, which

Aaron

00:46:41 – 00:46:43

is cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I

Ian

00:46:43 – 00:46:46

did have, like, Taylor was on once, and we reviewed Star Wars.

Aaron

00:46:46 – 00:46:46

Yeah.

Ian

00:46:46 – 00:46:59

Like, I had a guest on a couple times, but then the other episodes were just me. I don't know. It was a little different. It wasn't, like, as tight like, notes on work is generally, like, you know, ten minutes. Right?

Ian

00:47:00 – 00:47:02

Jeffrey Way does these sort of things too.

Aaron

00:47:02 – 00:47:03

Yeah. His are good.

Ian

00:47:03 – 00:47:09

On and off occasionally. Yeah. Is it a podcast? I only ever see them as video, but maybe I only see them as a podcast.

Aaron

00:47:09 – 00:47:10

It's probably a podcast.

Ian

00:47:10 – 00:47:11

Video? Yeah.

Aaron

00:47:11 – 00:47:12

Yeah.

Ian

00:47:13 – 00:47:22

So I don't know. Alright. What else we got on here? So you wrote down Interstellar, which I have a whole Interstellar story for you from just this weekend, but I don't know if you have your own story here since you've

Aaron

00:47:22 – 00:47:31

I have my own story here, and it is that I am going to see Interstellar in one hour and forty five minutes.

Ian

00:47:31 – 00:47:33

Yep. On IMAX. Right?

Aaron

00:47:33 – 00:47:45

On 70 millimeter IMAX. Yep. Yep. I so I booked this I booked this weeks and weeks ago. Yeah.

Aaron

00:47:45 – 00:47:51

They're bringing it back to theaters for the ten year anniversary. Ben Holman DM'd me and was

Ian

00:47:51 – 00:47:52

like, hey.

Aaron

00:47:52 – 00:47:53

Did you know that they're coming to Dallas?

Ian

00:47:53 – 00:47:58

Is the central like, they they paid him to spread the word on you. It's awesome. Yes. Yes. I was

Aaron

00:47:58 – 00:48:06

like, do you know they're coming to Dallas? And I went, and I didn't. And so I went and I looked. And so today is what? December 9?

Aaron

00:48:06 – 00:48:27

I looked originally at the week before, so, like, December 2, and this is way back in October. And showings were already sold out Yes. On a Monday morning, like, a month and a half ahead of time. Yep. And so I, like, immediately, as fast as I could, found a showing where I didn't have to sit, you know, off to the side Well,

Ian

00:48:27 – 00:48:33

that's and booked it. The iMacs, if you're off to the side, you might as well not even go. Like, you need to have a good seat at the iMac.

Aaron

00:48:33 – 00:48:46

Yeah. Yeah. So I'm going I'm going to see it in I've I don't think I've ever seen a 70 millimeter iMac. I think I saw Dunkirk in iMacs, but I'm I'm led to believe that there's something different about 70 millimeter. So

Ian

00:48:46 – 00:48:49

Taylor Swift was 70 millimeter, I think. And we

Aaron

00:48:49 – 00:48:50

saw that. That sounds right.

Ian

00:48:50 – 00:48:53

It's like a seven story Taylor Swift.

Aaron

00:48:53 – 00:49:01

That was, like, pretty incredible. So I am so excited. Man. I just cannot wait. It's gonna be I'm gonna cry so much.

Aaron

00:49:01 – 00:49:07

It's gonna be a freaking blast, and I hope they serve me some kind of food. Let's see. Where am I going? Oh, it's just me.

Ian

00:49:07 – 00:49:11

There's no serving food in the IMAX. Like, there's There's not get gross food at the counter.

Aaron

00:49:12 – 00:49:21

Yeah. The cinemark Dallas, IMAX. I wish Alamo had IMAX. So, yeah, super pumped. Cannot wait.

Aaron

00:49:21 – 00:49:29

I don't think I saw it in theaters when it first came out. And so this is gonna be this is gonna be a first time seeing it in theaters.

Ian

00:49:29 – 00:49:30

A perfect movie for IMAX, though.

Aaron

00:49:30 – 00:49:31

Like, some of the scenes,

Ian

00:49:31 – 00:49:39

like, at the black hole or whatever. Like, this is gonna be awesome on the IMAX or the tidal wave. Like, it's gonna be incredible. Like

Aaron

00:49:39 – 00:49:40

I can't wait.

Ian

00:49:40 – 00:49:48

So I have a similar story. Tell me. Ben Holman, right, like, was talking about it. He didn't messaged me directly, but he was talking about it. Oh, sorry.

Ian

00:49:48 – 00:49:59

Whatever that was. And it's like, it was no no ones were near me at all. And then I think New York City had some, and I looked, and they were all taken. Instantly. Yep.

Ian

00:49:59 – 00:50:09

And it was it was like, oh, I could have one seat, like, in the far corner. And I'm like, I don't even wanna deal with that. Whatever. I have, like, a nice TV at home. If I'm it's like, that's better than the far corner of iMac.

Ian

00:50:09 – 00:50:26

So forget that. So but then been home and again, this weekend said, hey, they released more tickets and I'm like, okay. You released more tickets. Good. So I go and there's tickets, both in New York City, but also in, West Nyack, which is like, whatever an hour from here.

Ian

00:50:26 – 00:50:43

Big biggest mall in the country or second biggest mall in the country. Some big mall, big mall that, is like an hour for me and has IMAX. So I'm like, great. I'm like, I'm just gonna buy it for Wednesday at 03:30 and I'm just gonna take kids out of school and it's gonna be fun. Like we never go see movies.

Ian

00:50:43 – 00:50:54

This will be like the tidal wave and the black hole. It'll be huge. It's gonna be awesome. And then I thought I could pay the $85 whatever. And then I started talking to Jamie and we go through it all.

Ian

00:50:54 – 00:51:03

And it's like, Max has his first basketball game, and Mia has a thing. And so now there's no interstellar. I can't even go. I'm not even going. Not

Aaron

00:51:03 – 00:51:05

sick. You're you're not gonna go?

Ian

00:51:05 – 00:51:08

I'm not going. I already refunded the tickets.

Aaron

00:51:08 – 00:51:10

Oh, dude.

Ian

00:51:10 – 00:51:22

I know. Because I wanna show it to the kids, and then I'm like, if I can't bring the kids, then I might as well just watch it at home. I'm not gonna watch it twice. Like, so I'll just watch it at home at some point and whatever. But very frustrating.

Ian

00:51:22 – 00:51:23

And then the v It sucks.

Aaron

00:51:23 – 00:51:24

So weird. Like, why don't they have

Ian

00:51:24 – 00:51:34

it for, like, two weeks? It's like, they literally have nothing starting Thursday. It's like Thursday, we're showing nothing. Well, why don't you just keep Interstellar in there rather than, like Yeah. So it's selling out.

Ian

00:51:34 – 00:51:37

Like, it's not like it's not selling out. You could have, I'm sure on

Aaron

00:51:37 – 00:51:38

Friday, you know, Friday,

Ian

00:51:38 – 00:51:39

Saturday. Sucks.

Aaron

00:51:40 – 00:51:40

I know.

Ian

00:51:41 – 00:51:44

So it's gonna be a nice little family time to Yeah.

Aaron

00:51:44 – 00:51:44

No no

Ian

00:51:44 – 00:51:50

failure. And even when I talk to the kids about it, they were like, I wouldn't wanna miss basketball. I wouldn't wanna miss my other family.

Aaron

00:51:50 – 00:51:59

It's a pretty good kid impression, honestly. Exactly. So wait till you get the teenagers. Wait till you have the teenagers. I will I will let you know how it is.

Ian

00:51:59 – 00:52:04

Let me know. We'll talk about it next week. Tell me how glorious when they're going into the black hole, how awesome it is.

Aaron

00:52:04 – 00:52:10

I'm gonna get I'm gonna get the biggest soda you've ever seen. I'm gonna get Diet Coke the size of your head.

Ian

00:52:10 – 00:52:12

That's gonna be amazing. Man.

Aaron

00:52:13 – 00:52:17

I don't know. No? I don't know. We'll see. If they have some chicken tendies, I'll do that instead of popcorn.

Ian

00:52:18 – 00:52:24

Chicken tendies. See? I don't know. Food in the movie, it's so weird to me. We just never had it around here, so it's like It's great.

Aaron

00:52:24 – 00:52:25

I mean, they always have

Ian

00:52:25 – 00:52:34

the bad chicken tendies, but they're, like, gross and disgusting. Like, AMC, I think, is maybe a little better on the food than, like Yeah. We have whatever. That other big we go. We have Regal on the food.

Ian

00:52:34 – 00:52:35

It's like

Aaron

00:52:35 – 00:52:35

Yeah.

Ian

00:52:35 – 00:52:39

I mean, I'd rather just go I just, like, make myself sick on peanut M and M's or whatever.

Aaron

00:52:40 – 00:52:41

Oh, that sounds good too. I should

Ian

00:52:41 – 00:52:46

do that. M and M. That's kinda my excuse. The movies is like, oh, I can't get this whole bag of peanut M and M's. That's fine.

Ian

00:52:46 – 00:52:46

It's the movies.

Aaron

00:52:46 – 00:52:48

It's the movies. It doesn't count.

Ian

00:52:48 – 00:52:49

Yeah. It doesn't count.

Aaron

00:52:49 – 00:52:53

Yeah. So I'll let you know how it is. It's gonna be that's gonna be awesome. Can't wait.

Ian

00:52:54 – 00:52:56

I might have to finagle myself into this somehow.

Aaron

00:52:56 – 00:52:58

I guess I can't go myself.

Ian

00:52:58 – 00:52:58

Maybe I'll You

Aaron

00:52:58 – 00:52:59

should just go yourself.

Ian

00:52:59 – 00:53:04

I mean, I don't I'm not opposed to that. Obviously, you're not opposed to that. Some people don't like to go to movies by themselves. I don't know.

Aaron

00:53:04 – 00:53:12

I mean, there's nothing better than going to a movie by yourself. There's really not. Yeah. Do whatever you want. Do whatever you want.

Aaron

00:53:12 – 00:53:17

There's no like, what are you going to? You know, you can't talk in a movie anyway.

Ian

00:53:17 – 00:53:17

I know.

Aaron

00:53:17 – 00:53:20

What are you supposed to do? Did you see that? Yeah. I saw that. I'm sitting right next to you.

Aaron

00:53:20 – 00:53:26

Like, what? You can't. It doesn't matter. This is this is pointless. Also, this is this is even further out there.

Aaron

00:53:26 – 00:53:29

Go into a restaurant by yourself. Awesome.

Ian

00:53:29 – 00:53:30

The best. Love it.

Aaron

00:53:30 – 00:53:31

Love it.

Ian

00:53:31 – 00:53:36

Before. My wife hates it. She doesn't wanna go to restaurant. I was like, this is the best. It's so great.

Ian

00:53:36 – 00:53:36

Like, I can just go

Aaron

00:53:36 – 00:53:37

to the bar.

Ian

00:53:38 – 00:53:49

I just they put the thing. All those people who can't even get a reservation, they're like, we can't get in there. It's impossible. You just walk in any night and you go sit at the bar and they're like, yeah, we got a spot for you right here. No problem.

Ian

00:53:49 – 00:53:53

No reservation. No nothing. You're by yourself. It's great. So good.

Ian

00:53:53 – 00:53:55

I love the restaurant by yourself. Love it.

Aaron

00:53:55 – 00:54:01

I haven't done that in a while either. I can't Oh, man. By myself. Me either. Can you imagine the luxury going to a restaurant by yourself?

Ian

00:54:01 – 00:54:09

That's actually do it more like, travel. I don't usually do it, like, around town, although I'm not supposed to. Yeah. I haven't been traveling, so I haven't been doing a restaurant by myself.

Aaron

00:54:10 – 00:54:13

That's how to get you. Alright. I got one more.

Ian

00:54:13 – 00:54:15

Yeah. So you talked at a conference.

Aaron

00:54:15 – 00:54:16

I spoke at a conference. Which is,

Ian

00:54:16 – 00:54:25

like, you just you just have these things happen. Isn't this weird? Like, it's like nobody knows you're speaking at this conference. I didn't know. I mean, nobody knew, but nobody knew.

Ian

00:54:25 – 00:54:30

Were you, like, actually published as, like, a thing? Was it, like, was it? Yeah. It's time published.

Aaron

00:54:30 – 00:54:35

Barely. Barely. So it was a conference. It was a conference here in Dallas. Yeah.

Aaron

00:54:35 – 00:54:46

Called Commit Your Code. And very strange because not like not our crew. You know? Normally, you go to a conference and you're just like, hey. How are you doing?

Aaron

00:54:46 – 00:54:51

Good to see you. Good to see you. And this one, I'm like, I know I know very few of you. It's like a dot

Ian

00:54:51 – 00:54:52

net thing?

Aaron

00:54:52 – 00:55:01

Or who who else? Yeah. It was it was way more corporate because it was a Dallas thing. And so it was like there were there were three tracks, first of all. Don't love a multitrack conference.

Ian

00:55:02 – 00:55:05

Lyricon's gonna be there soon. You know?

Aaron

00:55:05 – 00:55:08

No. We must resist. At some point. No. No.

Aaron

00:55:08 – 00:55:14

No. No. No. No. Speaking of shared experiences, one track conference, everybody has the same experience.

Aaron

00:55:14 – 00:55:15

I love that. I love that.

Ian

00:55:15 – 00:55:16

Love that.

Aaron

00:55:16 – 00:55:18

So the tracks were Java, cloud

Ian

00:55:19 – 00:55:19

Wow.

Aaron

00:55:19 – 00:55:20

And Java the Chromebook.

Ian

00:55:21 – 00:55:22

Java's still a thing?

Aaron

00:55:22 – 00:55:35

Java is it's big in in Dallas where it's all these, you know, stuffy corporate headquarters. Java's big. And, also, like, moving to the cloud is still a thing. It's just, like, insane. What year is it?

Aaron

00:55:35 – 00:55:36

I wanna learn Java.

Ian

00:55:36 – 00:55:38

Maybe someday I'll learn Java. When do you think about that?

Aaron

00:55:38 – 00:55:50

That's not worth it. So for there was the first year they've run it. They did an incredible job being first year. They went they went super big. First year, let's do three tracks and have 60 speakers.

Aaron

00:55:50 – 00:56:00

Like, what? Why are you doing this to yourself? I think there were, like, 350 in person and then several hundred more online.

Ian

00:56:01 – 00:56:03

See, that's not big enough for three tracks, I'm gonna say.

Aaron

00:56:03 – 00:56:08

Yeah. I I feel like one would have been fine, two maybe. But, anyway, Alright.

Ian

00:56:08 – 00:56:11

So it was cool, though. They did a good job. Sounds like the place was cool. They did a

Aaron

00:56:11 – 00:56:21

good job. Great job. It was hosted at, very interestingly, headquarters of Yum! Brands, which is, like, KFC, Taco Bell, and, I think, Pizza Hut. Yeah.

Aaron

00:56:21 – 00:56:26

Yeah. So that was kinda cool. So KFC Pizza Hut and Taco Bell were the lunch options, which is like,

Ian

00:56:26 – 00:56:26

hell, yeah.

Aaron

00:56:26 – 00:56:36

I love I love some Pizza Hut. So I saw that this conference was happening several months ago. Maybe in September, I saw that it was happening. Hold on.

Ian

00:56:36 – 00:56:37

Hold on. Wait. Wait. Hold on. I gotta I gotta stop you there.

Ian

00:56:37 – 00:56:53

It's just taking me a little while to process. So are the only options for food in this building those things, do you think? Like, is that what the cafeteria and the building is? Or is there no cafeteria in the building, and they brought you in from, like, outside? I don't know if you saw this while you're there.

Ian

00:56:53 – 00:56:57

Like, sound like, can I only eat KFC or Pizza Hut? There were parts

Aaron

00:56:57 – 00:57:15

of the building. Most of the building, we were not allowed access to. So we were in, like, the little meeting area that had a few big stages and a few breakout rooms and stuff. I I, you know, peaked beyond the sign and saw what appeared to be a cafeteria, but I I don't know if it was only KFC pizza I had to talk about.

Ian

00:57:15 – 00:57:22

How fascinating. That's like I know. Corporate and k like, this is all you can eat. What we make is the only like, that's how it should be.

Aaron

00:57:22 – 00:57:23

It's how it should be.

Ian

00:57:23 – 00:57:23

Should be.

Aaron

00:57:23 – 00:57:24

That's dog food.

Ian

00:57:25 – 00:57:31

I feel like it's not that just based on the food that they're serving, but it should be that. Yeah. It should be that. Alright. Anyway.

Aaron

00:57:32 – 00:57:34

So it was good. They brought us some some good food.

Ian

00:57:34 – 00:57:35

Okay. Good.

Aaron

00:57:35 – 00:57:44

So I saw that this was happening in maybe September. Saw it on Twitter. I was like, hey. Doing a conference in Dallas, all these people. It's like, I live in Dallas.

Aaron

00:57:44 – 00:57:46

Let me I let me let me just reach out.

Ian

00:57:46 – 00:57:48

Doing stuff again. You're always just doing stuff.

Aaron

00:57:48 – 00:57:55

Doing stuff. Doing things. You can't stop doing stuff, man. Damn it. So I reached out to the guy, sent him a DM, and was like, hey.

Aaron

00:57:55 – 00:58:08

Saw that this is in Dallas. If you need another speaker, I'm always open to come up and and speak. Let me know. Did he know you were Sure. I he I think he followed me on Twitter at that point.

Aaron

00:58:08 – 00:58:15

Okay. But he was he said, sure. Sounds great. Let's do it. It's like, well, first of all, that was easy.

Aaron

00:58:15 – 00:58:31

You you just ask. So, you know, I I did a new and updated version of, publishing your work increases your luck. Included included the layoff in there, which is great. Nice. Good content.

Ian

00:58:31 – 00:58:32

Lovely good layoff story.

Aaron

00:58:32 – 00:58:47

Included the layoff to riches. Exactly. Starting TriHard Studios, had to cut it down from forty minutes to twenty five, but I still did it in thirty. So oopsie doopsie, but that was fine. Just it went great.

Aaron

00:58:47 – 00:59:04

I crushed it. It went great. It was awesome. And on the just doing things note, I before my talk, I told the organizer, I said, Danny, this is my this talk is my audition to be your keynote speaker for next year.

Ian

00:59:04 – 00:59:05

Oh, snap.

Aaron

00:59:05 – 00:59:21

Just calling my shot saying, hey. If this works, I wanna be your keynote keynote speaker. Yep. And so, like, the day after the, the day after the conference ended, he sent me a video of himself in the car and was like, hey. Thanks for coming out.

Aaron

00:59:23 – 00:59:29

I'm trying to, you know, lock down speakers for next year. Do you want a keynote next year? And I was

Ian

00:59:29 – 00:59:30

like, I do. I

Aaron

00:59:30 – 00:59:32

do want a keynote, so

Ian

00:59:32 – 00:59:37

it worked. Wow. Congratulations. Thanks. Yeah.

Ian

00:59:37 – 00:59:42

Another, leading by example on your part Yes. Making stuff happen.

Aaron

00:59:42 – 00:59:43

That's right.

Ian

00:59:43 – 00:59:54

I love it. Yeah. People don't realize, like, there's all these things in the world that, like, people hate dealing with. Like, finding speakers for a conference is actually terrible. And if you can it's a fine line.

Ian

00:59:54 – 01:00:06

Right? Because, obviously, lots of people just be like, woah. Make me the speaker. Like and that that alone isn't probably enough, but it's like the combination of, like, you're doing stuff, you're putting good stuff out there that's provable evidence that you have

Aaron

01:00:06 – 01:00:08

something interesting to say. And then

Ian

01:00:08 – 01:00:30

you ask, and then, oh, yeah. Like, this guy looks reasonable. Let's give him a shot because I need to find somebody for this and it's gonna be annoying and that's one less thing I have to do, especially if they're doing 60 speaking slots It's like yeah, that's a lot of speakers to go through and now it's one less and I got a keynote and it's like a headliner and I can put them up there. So Mhmm. That's awesome.

Ian

01:00:30 – 01:00:36

So now also redoing a talk you already did, people don't do that and you should because, like, nobody's

Aaron

01:00:36 – 01:00:36

seen Totally.

Ian

01:00:36 – 01:00:41

Talk before. Like Correct. You know what I mean? Like, if two people have seen it, who cares? And Mhmm.

Ian

01:00:41 – 01:00:48

Everybody else is new. So that's also a smart strategy because like you said, then you can crush it. You've already done it before.

Aaron

01:00:48 – 01:00:49

Already done it.

Ian

01:00:49 – 01:01:00

Like, the things you'd wanna do differently and all that stuff. So that's great. But yeah. Now what about the speaking circuit? Is this a thing you're interested in?

Aaron

01:01:00 – 01:01:20

I don't know. So I am interested I am interested in the speaking circuit to the extent that it exposes me to new audiences, I think. Yeah. So, like, I I am going to I'm speaking at Lyricon EU. Right?

Aaron

01:01:20 – 01:01:34

Not a new audience, but these are my people. Super fun. Very exciting. But, like, speaking at React Miami, for example Mhmm. I'll have anything to say on React.

Aaron

01:01:34 – 01:01:52

But could I could I get to the point where it's like I'm like a Kelsey Hightower of Right. The the new age, right, where I'm kind of, like, not specifically talking about the technology that's there, but more, like, broader human principles, maybe. I'd be super

Ian

01:01:52 – 01:01:55

interested in that. Webs. Talk.

Aaron

01:01:55 – 01:02:08

Yeah. I'd be super interested in that, but what I I'm not interested in is, like, beyond, like, beyond our little circle, I'm not interested in giving highly technical talks at other conferences, I don't think.

Ian

01:02:08 – 01:02:24

Yeah. Talks are such a weird thing. I feel like they're definitely valuable in the, like, go from unknown to known. Like Yes. That is a personal branding win if you can get a little you know, do some talks and and elevate your status like that.

Ian

01:02:24 – 01:02:39

I'm a little more dubious on the, like, business economic value of being a speaker. Like, can I actually yes? You can improve your brand. Can you make money doing it if you have, like once you reach a certain level? I think, yes.

Ian

01:02:39 – 01:03:00

Like, you definitely can if you then reach that that Kelsey Hightower level. Right? Like, of course, then you can. But, like, there's that middle ground of, like, are you gonna grind to the level required to become the ubiquitous speaker of web development conferences or not. And then, like, is that time well spent or not or whatever, you know, all that stuff.

Ian

01:03:00 – 01:03:02

So I don't know. Interesting to say. Yeah.

Aaron

01:03:02 – 01:03:03

I honestly don't know.

Ian

01:03:03 – 01:03:12

Yeah. The it's I think it seems like a reasonable strategy to do a few and try it out and see how they go and see if you can then leverage that into bigger ones and all

Aaron

01:03:12 – 01:03:41

that good stuff too. That's that's the idea is try to, like, try to leverage past wins, which I think is is a good principle. Leverage past wins into future wins. And so the whole, like, I'm gonna go speak at this conference where it's like, I know, you know, maybe 10% of the people, which was the case this weekend or the last week. I'm gonna speak at this conference with hopes that I can maybe keynote the next year, or somebody at this conference can turn me on to another conference where I get to speak there.

Aaron

01:03:42 – 01:03:52

And so, yeah, there's a little there's a little bit of strategy to it in terms of, like, trying to expand beyond just the Laravel circle.

Ian

01:03:53 – 01:03:53

Right.

Aaron

01:03:53 – 01:04:11

And a little bit of, like, I don't really know what is gonna happen. Like, I don't know what's out there. So Yeah. Somebody, somebody tweeted at both the render ATL organizer and the React Miami organizer, and said that I need to be their keynote speaker

Ian

01:04:11 – 01:04:11

Mhmm.

Aaron

01:04:12 – 01:04:17

At those conferences. And so it's like, woah. Maybe maybe it's gonna work. I don't know. And so You're

Ian

01:04:17 – 01:04:20

actually speaking at React Miami, are you? Like, a fit wait.

Aaron

01:04:20 – 01:04:21

As of

Ian

01:04:21 – 01:04:21

right now?

Aaron

01:04:21 – 01:04:22

Not yet. Okay. No.

Ian

01:04:22 – 01:04:25

You said that before, and I wasn't sure if you meant, like, you are speaking there or not, but you're not.

Aaron

01:04:25 – 01:04:45

No. I wasn't right now speaking. But, yeah, as of now, I'm not. Okay. But, yeah, trying to figure out, like, trying to figure out and, you know, I I have this outside dream of, like, being a being a corporate speaker, like, you know, going going back up to young brands and inspired the KFC folks and getting paid a bunch of money for it.

Aaron

01:04:45 – 01:04:45

Ian

01:04:46 – 01:04:48

even, like, HubSpot or something. Like, I could

Aaron

01:04:48 – 01:04:49

see a

Ian

01:04:49 – 01:04:58

HubSpot conference. It's like a little overlap of, like, technology, web stuff, but not maybe about that. It's about, you know, whatever. It's five tracks, a million things. Right?

Ian

01:04:58 – 01:05:06

So, like, being in that kind of like, hey. It's a 10,000 person. It's a 20,000 person conference. Like, being at those kind of things.

Aaron

01:05:06 – 01:05:20

Or or even smaller, but in the same vein as Nathan Barry's craft and commerce. Like Right. Would would love to go speak there, and that's, like, you know, that's a that's a half step outside of, like, a developer circle. Not totally outside. Yeah.

Aaron

01:05:20 – 01:05:26

And so that could be another good one, like, on my way up or out to speak at something like that.

Ian

01:05:26 – 01:05:39

The other interesting thing is if you could get dialed in with, like, kinda like what we're talking about, but, like like, Seth Godin. I saw him speak several times. Right? And, like, he just has, like, the Seth Godin talk. And, like, I mean, it's probably within a time frame.

Ian

01:05:39 – 01:05:44

I'm sure he's had different ones, but he's, like, he's going to this, all these conferences and he's given the same talk.

Aaron

01:05:44 – 01:05:45

I would love that for,

Ian

01:05:45 – 01:05:49

you know, $50, they're paying him or whatever to come give the same talk. You, you

Aaron

01:05:49 – 01:05:50

call, I'll do it for 40.

Ian

01:05:50 – 01:05:57

Places on the internet. Right? Yeah. And, but you're not gonna go search the internet for it. So he can just give the same talk over and over.

Ian

01:05:57 – 01:06:14

And if you're one of the people who's seen it, you don't go to it or you go to it again if you like it, whatever. But, like, nobody's worried about that. He's big enough where he just gives the same talk every time or whatever, former presidents, whatever. All these people just give the same talk every time. And that would be a nice place to be because then you could just be you're just showing up and you're like, I gotta talk.

Ian

01:06:14 – 01:06:16

Like, one, two, one, one, two, one, two, one,

Aaron

01:06:16 – 01:06:20

two, one, two, one, two, one, two, one, two, one, two, one, two, one, two, one, and getting paid $25, 20 grand,

Ian

01:06:20 – 01:06:25

something like that. And get the exposure. You get some money. Once you get a

Aaron

01:06:25 – 01:06:27

So that's what I gotta do.

Ian

01:06:27 – 01:06:27

You should write a book.

Aaron

01:06:27 – 01:06:29

That is usually the angle into that. Yep.

Ian

01:06:29 – 01:06:31

I do feel like yeah.

Aaron

01:06:31 – 01:06:34

I've got I've got I've got one. I've got one. What do you got?

Ian

01:06:34 – 01:06:37

Oh, no. No. No. No. I'm pulling it in.

Aaron

01:06:37 – 01:06:40

No. I'm pulling it in. I can't do it. I can't do it. Nope.

Aaron

01:06:40 – 01:06:42

You're sharing. It's too precious.

Ian

01:06:43 – 01:06:45

I'm the private. I know. You're the sharing guy.

Aaron

01:06:45 – 01:06:50

I know how the turntables, but it's too it's too precious. I can't it's too nice.

Ian

01:06:50 – 01:06:53

Can you give us, like, I assume is it fiction or nonfiction?

Aaron

01:06:54 – 01:06:55

Nonfiction. Is it,

Ian

01:06:57 – 01:07:01

web related? Not at all. Okay. Good. General.

Ian

01:07:01 – 01:07:03

Is it more general interest then?

Aaron

01:07:03 – 01:07:03

Yes.

Ian

01:07:03 – 01:07:04

Okay.

Aaron

01:07:04 – 01:07:14

Interesting. This is this is it's gonna sound crazy when I say it out loud. This is my book to become a New York Times bestseller author. I like it. So I can't

Ian

01:07:14 – 01:07:16

I can't got the goals.

Aaron

01:07:16 – 01:07:18

I can't. Yeah. That's all I can say.

Ian

01:07:18 – 01:07:21

Doesn't sound like somebody's gonna be retired in ten years to me, but I like it.

Aaron

01:07:22 – 01:07:23

Well, not like retired retired,

Ian

01:07:23 – 01:07:28

but yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Not retired retired. So what about you and chat GPT?

Ian

01:07:28 – 01:07:32

You sit down. You crank this baby out in a month. Let's go.

Aaron

01:07:33 – 01:07:52

It's on the table. I mean, it would probably take it probably take six months to a year to, like, to do it. But it's one of those things where you have to start the background process. Yeah. And let it simmer because you're gathering examples and you're gathering new, axioms, principles.

Aaron

01:07:53 – 01:08:00

You're you're just, like, you're taking it all in. You're absorbing. So keeping the and Yes. Exactly. Yeah.

Aaron

01:08:00 – 01:08:11

Anecdotes, all that sort of stuff. And so when the time comes, I hope it will be somewhat quick. But the simmer has not completed yet. But in time

Ian

01:08:11 – 01:08:27

an area that I actually think we've lost and is unfortunate is books where, like I remember when I started like, within the first three years of launching HelpSpot, I was in, like, four books, and I didn't write these books. Like, people just reference me and HelpSpot by name in these books. And it's like That's cool.

Aaron

01:08:27 – 01:08:28

They were, like, books on

Ian

01:08:28 – 01:08:36

bootstrapping and startups, and it's like like, that was so cool to look at. Like, what I did is real. Like, somebody put, like, a new book. Holy shit. Is that crazy?

Ian

01:08:36 – 01:08:46

And, like, nobody writes books. Like, like, everybody has whatever. You tweet stuff or you have a blog post or you do a video, and it's, like, all ephemeral. Yeah. And it doesn't have that, like, oh, man.

Ian

01:08:46 – 01:08:58

Like, my product was named in a book. And even though we didn't get even a single sale from any of that, it's like, it doesn't matter because it's just like, that was cool. It's like printed and out there. And, yeah, I don't know. I kinda missed that.

Ian

01:08:58 – 01:09:05

I kinda wanna make I kinda wanna do a book even though I'm not a very good writer, but I kinda wanna do a book and just put in, like, all the people we know. Because, like, that'd be cool. Like, they were gonna

Aaron

01:09:05 – 01:09:05

be they're

Ian

01:09:05 – 01:09:11

gonna get a thrill out of, like, having their name in a book. Yep. Because it's cool when you see your name printed there. You're like, holy shit.

Aaron

01:09:11 – 01:09:18

It is. Well, maybe I'll do my best to see if I can get, to get you into this book. Yeah. I got me in. Get me in, baby.

Aaron

01:09:18 – 01:09:22

Make it I'm gonna acknowledge round five for you. Send it to us four. Yeah.

Ian

01:09:23 – 01:09:27

Yeah. Or, like, I could be a beta read like, Sanderson does his beta readers. And then You

Aaron

01:09:27 – 01:09:28

can be a beta reader.

Ian

01:09:28 – 01:09:33

All the beta readers and all this stuff. So you could have that that's an angle. Yep.

Aaron

01:09:35 – 01:09:37

Alright. Well, I like this whole book idea. It's a good idea.

Ian

01:09:37 – 01:09:46

This is very this is very errant. Oh, well, while we're talking about things you're gonna do. K. What you were you were gonna whittle us, you're whittling something, people are guessing

Aaron

01:09:46 – 01:09:52

not whittling. I don't I don't whittling. We use machines. We use machines. Are you and the machine

Ian

01:09:52 – 01:09:53

still whittling a thing?

Aaron

01:09:53 – 01:10:10

It will still it will still come to pass that something will be, created. So Okay. It's not gonna happen here in the apartment. Oh, you're not gonna happen at home because just too much going on at home. So it's gonna it has to wait for the factory.

Aaron

01:10:10 – 01:10:20

Right. And the factory might, in fact, wait, until April or May. Oh, woah. Hey. Yep.

Ian

01:10:20 – 01:10:23

I thought you had a contract. I thought you signed a contract or no?

Aaron

01:10:23 – 01:10:34

No. We had an agreement in principle to start January 1, and then the guy the guy has been dragging his feet on getting us an actual lease. What do these people do? You have one job. What do you do?

Aaron

01:10:35 – 01:10:38

I'm asking you for a lease every day. No. You're like, I'll get it I'll get it to you.

Ian

01:10:38 – 01:10:39

You're like, oh, it's moving.

Aaron

01:10:39 – 01:10:40

It's happening. January 1. It was.

Ian

01:10:40 – 01:10:43

Doesn't sound right. I've I've never heard anybody move into a office space this quickly.

Aaron

01:10:43 – 01:10:46

So this guy just, like, dragged his feet a bunch.

Ian

01:10:46 – 01:10:52

And He just likes the empty space sitting there, making him no money because he can't be bothered to do. Yes. That's crazy. We The

Aaron

01:10:53 – 01:10:58

We should get in charge of everything, man. Why are we not in charge of everything? I just want to work

Ian

01:10:58 – 01:10:59

with the business so bad. I

Aaron

01:10:59 – 01:11:00

feel like you

Ian

01:11:00 – 01:11:04

just run it in the most basic fashion, and you'd crush everybody else. But, anyway

Aaron

01:11:04 – 01:11:07

It'd be amazing. So I talked to Steve

Ian

01:11:07 – 01:11:08

contract. Yeah.

Aaron

01:11:08 – 01:11:33

Talked to Steve sometime last week, and, basically, I was just telling him, boy, do I feel stressed and overwhelmed? And he was like, what if we just put off the factory for three to four months? Yeah. And I was like, oh, man, that would make me feel a whole lot better because I started to look at the timing, and I was like, okay. Well, I've gotta I've gotta one, I've gotta finish Postgres, which is almost done.

Aaron

01:11:33 – 01:11:42

Gotta finish Postgres. Gotta do, gotta create this library for Laracon EU. It's only, like, you know, 40% done.

Ian

01:11:43 – 01:11:45

Library building. I don't know, man.

Aaron

01:11:45 – 01:11:49

I know. So we gotta do this. Then at some point, we're gonna do

Ian

01:11:49 – 01:11:51

Can you just switch that talk? Just switch it.

Aaron

01:11:51 – 01:11:54

He'll let you know. Don't don't don't give up. Don't give in.

Ian

01:11:54 – 01:11:56

Then you have to maintain the library.

Aaron

01:11:57 – 01:11:59

Yeah. It's okay. Everything is possible. It's okay.

Ian

01:12:00 – 01:12:01

No upside in that library.

Aaron

01:12:02 – 01:12:02

We'll see. Whatever it is,

Ian

01:12:02 – 01:12:03

there's no upside.

Aaron

01:12:03 – 01:12:04

It's a good library.

Ian

01:12:04 – 01:12:09

I mean, that's fine. But what bring in somebody else. Have them build a library. Oh, maybe that's

Aaron

01:12:09 – 01:12:10

a good idea.

Ian

01:12:10 – 01:12:10

That's the play.

Aaron

01:12:10 – 01:12:11

Yeah. There's all you know,

Ian

01:12:11 – 01:12:15

all these people do it together with somebody else. You'll be the face. They'll write the code.

Aaron

01:12:16 – 01:12:16

I do like that.

Ian

01:12:16 – 01:12:19

You're not gonna you're not gonna be taking this thing.

Aaron

01:12:19 – 01:12:21

I like writing the code. The You like writing the main

Ian

01:12:21 – 01:12:26

version point one. You don't want it when there's 400 bugs with this thing.

Aaron

01:12:26 – 01:12:26

I do.

Ian

01:12:26 – 01:12:29

You don't wanna be in there doing those bugs. That's the worst That's

Aaron

01:12:29 – 01:12:29

probably true.

Ian

01:12:29 – 01:12:34

You could possibly have. It's literally totally negative value of your time.

Aaron

01:12:34 – 01:12:37

Well, it's it's too late. It's too late. It's too late for any of this.

Ian

01:12:37 – 01:12:38

So Okay. Continue.

Aaron

01:12:38 – 01:12:51

So I gotta write this library, got a prayer talk, and then Right. We're doing screencasting.com. Steve is starting to record his portion soon. Now I gotta start recording my portion soon. And so we looked at this.

Aaron

01:12:51 – 01:12:55

It was like, man, if we get the factory on January 1, it's gonna be four weeks.

Ian

01:12:56 – 01:12:57

That's gonna take over.

Aaron

01:12:57 – 01:12:59

Moving, building, unbuilding, rebuilding

Ian

01:13:00 – 01:13:02

like, whatever. Dude, and

Aaron

01:13:02 – 01:13:11

so. Yeah. He was just like, we're we don't we haven't signed anything. We haven't signed anything. This guy won't respond to us, so let's just put it off for a while.

Aaron

01:13:11 – 01:13:19

It's like, wow, that's a really good idea. And I told Jennifer that that that Steve mentioned that, and she said, tell Steve I said thank you. And I was like,

Ian

01:13:19 – 01:13:20

oh, shoot.

Aaron

01:13:20 – 01:13:32

Yeah. Maybe maybe everyone sees it but me, which is entirely possible. So we're gonna put that off till screen casting is done. So probably, you know, April, March, April, May.

Ian

01:13:32 – 01:13:35

Gonna let you go month to month on your current place? Or

Aaron

01:13:36 – 01:13:46

there's a month to month, option. There's also, like, a renew for, you know, three, four, five, six, seven months with different prices for each. And But you're gonna be able

Ian

01:13:46 – 01:13:47

to stay there.

Aaron

01:13:47 – 01:13:48

I'll be able to stay. Yeah.

Ian

01:13:48 – 01:13:48

Yeah.

Aaron

01:13:48 – 01:13:54

Yeah. Growing up grown up Steve is taking care of it. He was like, just send me the lease. And I was like, god. This is the freaking best.

Aaron

01:13:54 – 01:14:08

So I love having a responsible adult on the team. So, yes, we're still gonna whittle the timeline as with all good things. The timeline has shifted a little bit. But, yeah, we'll still we got this. We got a lot to do.

Ian

01:14:08 – 01:14:22

This is the perfect bookend to how we started this conversation, because there's just not as much time as you think. That's just the reality. And ten years is going to happen instantaneously. You're going to be like, oh, the kids are 12. What the hell happened?

Ian

01:14:23 – 01:14:28

Like, where'd all that time go? It just goes by so incredibly fast. So it

Aaron

01:14:28 – 01:14:40

turns out maybe so. Here's here's my here's my, here's my unformed philosophy on that Total this is this is this is off the dome. Okay?

Ian

01:14:40 – 01:14:41

Okay. Mhmm.

Aaron

01:14:41 – 01:14:48

I am doing too much. That's that's just the start. Clear. That is that is clear. That's obvious.

Aaron

01:14:48 – 01:14:54

I'm doing too much. I'm stressed out all the time. There have been nights I've cried myself to sleep because I'm so stressed out.

Ian

01:14:54 – 01:14:58

That's a little too much. Too far. Yeah. That's too much. And you're doing here's the thing.

Ian

01:14:58 – 01:15:14

You're doing well. Right? Like, you gotta save that for when you're not doing well. Like, when the business has a hiccup, when things are looking not as rosy, that you let the emotions lose a little bit. But if you're already to that, when you're having a great year, you've had a great year.

Aaron

01:15:14 – 01:15:15

Great year.

Ian

01:15:15 – 01:15:16

So you're doing. But here's

Aaron

01:15:16 – 01:15:19

here's my here's my here's my unformed philosophy.

Ian

01:15:19 – 01:15:20

There was the philosophy. Yes.

Aaron

01:15:21 – 01:15:41

I don't know if it's I don't know if it's possible to do the right amount. I feel like I feel like most people oscillate or most people I don't maybe not oscillate. Most people pick doing too much or doing too little. Yeah. And I think most people pick doing too little.

Aaron

01:15:41 – 01:16:01

And I don't wanna do I don't want to do too little. And so my my unformed philosophy is to push as hard as I possibly can and then have to shed a few things here and there rather than, not live up to what I want my life to be. You

Ian

01:16:01 – 01:16:02

know? Potential.

Aaron

01:16:02 – 01:16:15

Yeah. My not even my potential, but what I want out of life. Yeah. Like, potential is some, like, objective outside thing. Like, oh, he didn't live up to what he could have been.

Aaron

01:16:15 – 01:16:23

Mhmm. I'm not I'm not terribly interested in that. I'm I'm interested in I didn't live up to what I wanted to do. You know?

Ian

01:16:23 – 01:16:43

You the things you believe are achievable, and if you don't get there, that type of thing. Yeah. Yeah. I think the thing the problem when you're an entrepreneur comparing yourself to, like, the abstract most people is that most people have a very defined like, if they wanna get ahead. Okay?

Aaron

01:16:43 – 01:16:44

Mhmm.

Ian

01:16:44 – 01:16:50

They wanna make more money. They wanna have a better job. Whatever. They actually have a very defined path to that. Like They do.

Ian

01:16:50 – 01:17:03

I'm in this corporate wheel. Yep. I understand very clearly what I have to do and I could choose not to, or I could choose to do it, but it's like, if I I only have to work hard in this very particular way. Yeah. And I and I know what that way is.

Ian

01:17:03 – 01:17:13

Like, it's not even a mystery. It's like, this is you're getting reviews. You're getting all this stuff. It's like, this is what we want you to do to move ahead. And, generally, that is accurate.

Ian

01:17:14 – 01:17:30

Whereas when you're on your own, it's like you could do anything. Right? Like, everything is potentially beneficial. And so that is where the rub is. It's like, you gotta narrow that part down to, like, what what are the things that are actually moving ahead and what does moving ahead even mean?

Ian

01:17:30 – 01:17:50

Because does moving ahead mean more time for my family? Does moving ahead mean more money? Does moving ahead mean a bigger business that's more valuable that I can sell? Does moving ahead mean I get to do interesting things, even if at the sacrifice of some of those other right? Like, so you got to figure out that balance, and that is hard because there's not a game plan for it.

Ian

01:17:50 – 01:17:50

There's just

Aaron

01:17:50 – 01:17:51

Sure is.

Ian

01:17:51 – 01:17:53

Yeah. You could do anything, which is You can

Aaron

01:17:53 – 01:17:57

do anything, which leads to doing everything, which leads Or nothing. Right?

Ian

01:17:57 – 01:17:58

Like Yes.

Aaron

01:17:58 – 01:18:01

Yes. It leads to stress. You're incapacitated by the stress of

Ian

01:18:01 – 01:18:24

I could do anything, or you are motivated by it, but then it's becomes I'm doing everything, which leads to kind of doing nothing in its own way because nothing gets your full attention for long enough to become the the big thing. Right? So, like, that is the tricky bit for sure. So I think it's interesting to see you coming around. You're struggling.

Ian

01:18:24 – 01:18:30

You're pushing boundaries. Mhmm. And you're resetting. Mhmm. You're getting there.

Aaron

01:18:30 – 01:18:37

This is, this is expand and contract. Yeah. So we've got explore and exploit, which is a framework. We've got expand and contract. Yeah.

Aaron

01:18:37 – 01:18:46

So it's not totally dissimilar, but but it's slightly different. I feel like I do too much, and then I pull back.

Ian

01:18:46 – 01:18:46

And

Aaron

01:18:46 – 01:18:57

then I do too much, and then I pull back. And somewhere somewhere, the lines fall such that it works out. But Yeah. I think we're currently in a phase of doing too much and

Ian

01:18:57 – 01:18:58

And maybe

Aaron

01:18:58 – 01:19:01

trying to pull back. And that Steve is very helpful in this.

Ian

01:19:01 – 01:19:10

I was just gonna say Steve because it's not even it might not be too much. It might just be the wrong timeline. Right? Like, it's an unrealistic timeline. Like, I wanna do all

Aaron

01:19:10 – 01:19:10

of this

Ian

01:19:10 – 01:19:16

by January 30. Well, that might not be realistic. Right? But, like Totally. If it's over two years

Aaron

01:19:16 – 01:19:20

self driving cars for the next thirty days. Yeah. You would need

Ian

01:19:20 – 01:19:23

to get a job at SpaceX. Forget the boy. I would go to Mars next year.

Aaron

01:19:23 – 01:19:26

I would crush one of his companies.

Ian

01:19:26 – 01:19:27

You should be the face man.

Aaron

01:19:27 – 01:19:31

Actually, you probably hurt my feelings a lot, and I would quit immediately.

Ian

01:19:33 – 01:19:34

You would last two seconds.

Aaron

01:19:34 – 01:19:35

Oh, in the last days.

Ian

01:19:35 – 01:19:38

No. You're gonna be off base crying in the first day.

Aaron

01:19:38 – 01:19:41

What did you say? Exactly.

Ian

01:19:41 – 01:19:42

I just said the thing you told me

Aaron

01:19:42 – 01:19:47

to say yesterday. I don't think that way anymore. Like Anyway. Yeah. I'd be gone.

Aaron

01:19:47 – 01:19:48

But But, yeah, we do have

Ian

01:19:48 – 01:19:54

that time. The timeline. The timeline. Like, you might just have to, you know, jiggle the timeline a little.

Aaron

01:19:54 – 01:19:57

Break down longer term. Setting aggressive timelines.

Ian

01:19:58 – 01:20:05

Yeah. It does. It is helpful for getting stuff done to be aggressive with your timelines. It's motivating, but you just can't operate that way all the time. It's very

Aaron

01:20:06 – 01:20:07

difficult. Very difficult.

Ian

01:20:07 – 01:20:09

Yeah. With four kids in a way.

Aaron

01:20:09 – 01:20:10

Especially with four kids.

Ian

01:20:10 – 01:20:14

You're not single guy living in the city. I'm not grinding. No. Not that

Aaron

01:20:14 – 01:20:16

I'm married guy living in the city grinding.

Ian

01:20:16 – 01:20:46

As we talked about, this is honestly the easiest phase of that Because, like, even though it's also the hardest, it's, like, very hard because the kids are crying and they're wiping butts and all stuff. But then there's just stuff you have to do with them and they wanna do and you wanna do with them. And it's just stuff you don't you can't it's like after school, we're doing the soccer thing and the other thing and blah blah. And it's like stuff you refuse to miss, which is good, but, like, there is no replacement time for that. Like, once you give away those two hours, like, you are not going to be able to find those two hours in some other part of your day that you didn't weren't using already.

Ian

01:20:46 – 01:20:53

Like, that time is just gone. And so you're just not gonna be able to operate on that level. You know? So that's where it's it does the issue. So

Aaron

01:20:54 – 01:21:11

And that's, honestly, that's part of that's part of the calculus of, like, going so hard right now. Like, I do I do wanna be able in the future to be done at 03:00 so that I can go, you know, hang out after school. Like, that is definitely on my mind. And so Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

01:21:11 – 01:21:14

This is this is not a forever thing.

Ian

01:21:14 – 01:21:30

It's interesting though, because then that's like a grinding for, like, the financial freedom to do that. Yeah. Essentially. And that would then lead you to, I think, different decisions if that was the main factor. If that becomes the main part, like, the main like, you have things that work and you sell and you could just do more of that.

Aaron

01:21:30 – 01:21:31

Right. Do you

Ian

01:21:31 – 01:21:36

know what I'm saying? Like I do. Have a thing that works. We could just do more of that. We'll make more money.

Ian

01:21:37 – 01:21:43

And that is the straightforward safe plan to having those two hours on Wednesday afternoon.

Aaron

01:21:43 – 01:21:48

Yes. And I think I think, I think the ship is pointed more in that direction

Ian

01:21:48 – 01:21:49

That seems like a little

Aaron

01:21:49 – 01:21:52

bit days than in it was even, you know, three weeks ago.

Ian

01:21:53 – 01:21:53

Right.

Aaron

01:21:53 – 01:22:04

So but there there's always there's always in my mind, like, there's always short term, long term trade offs.

Ian

01:22:04 – 01:22:04

For sure.

Aaron

01:22:04 – 01:22:16

Right? Like, speaking at this conference is a long term thing. Yep. I maybe, you know, maybe was able to sell one course just by saying this is who I am and what I do. It's not worth it.

Aaron

01:22:16 – 01:22:25

Right? It's not it's not worth monetarily. But long term, it might be worth it. And so I'm constantly trying to balance. Alright.

Aaron

01:22:25 – 01:22:38

How do we how do we move some courses? Like, how do we get these things moving? But, also, what's gonna come in two to three to five to ten years? Right. And those seeds, we need to start planting those now.

Ian

01:22:39 – 01:22:41

Yeah. And there's only so many databases. Like, all that stuff we've already

Aaron

01:22:41 – 01:22:42

talked about.

Ian

01:22:42 – 01:22:56

It's only so many of those things. And but some of the things like the talk I think the speaking's kinda cool because it's like, you have a strong desire to do, like, different types of things. So, like, maybe they can be things that are, like, yeah, more like one hit. Right? It's like, whatever.

Ian

01:22:56 – 01:23:02

I work on something for a couple weeks and it's done. Like, I'm going to do this talk and I prepare and I do the talk. And I did it, and it was fun.

Aaron

01:23:02 – 01:23:04

And now I'm done with that.

Ian

01:23:04 – 01:23:10

You know what I mean? It's not like taking on a new I think the problem I've definitely had myself is like, oh, I'll build a new app. And then

Aaron

01:23:10 – 01:23:11

long term commitment.

Ian

01:23:11 – 01:23:21

It's a new long term commitment, which just interferes with the other long term commitment. Right. And even if it doesn't actually interfere, it's like the stress of it and all this stuff. Oh, well, like yeah. But I've Totally.

Ian

01:23:21 – 01:23:32

On this show. We've we all listened as I've started something and been like, that's a stupid idea. I'm just I'm trying to learn from my mistakes. And I Yep. I still haven't learned to not even start them, but I start them and then I Never

Aaron

01:23:32 – 01:23:35

learn that. You must always start things. Don't learn that you

Ian

01:23:35 – 01:23:44

can't start things. That's true. Possibly. Possibly. But I'm also towards the other side of it where now I can see, like, man, one kid's already in college.

Ian

01:23:44 – 01:23:54

The other one's not that far behind. Then I got the baby who's not even that far behind them. So I have the other side of it soon where it's like, oh, man. Like, we have all this time. We don't have anybody, and it wouldn't be for anybody.

Ian

01:23:55 – 01:24:02

But then I'll need lots of activities. Alright. Cool. That's how we wrap it. How's it going?

Aaron

01:24:03 – 01:24:04

Alright. Let's call it there.

Ian

01:24:04 – 01:24:26

Call it there. Nice arc to the show today. Thanks everybody, for listening. Follow us at mostlytechnical.com at mostly tech pod, mostlytechnicalpodcast@gmail.com, mostly technical on blue sky, mostly technical dot com. And, we will see you next week later.

Ian

01:24:26 – 01:24:27

See you. Bye.

Doing Too Much

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