Try Hard Studios

Ian

Alright. Welcome back.

Aaron

Mister Landsman, how we doing?

Ian

Good. Good. I wanna start off with we have our 1st, commercial sponsor of the podcast.

Aaron

We did it.

Ian

Just very cool. Thank you, to let me bring it up. Thank you to Laracast, long time friend, Geoffrey Way. LaraCast, I mean, I've been using LaraCast for 10 years, literally. So, if you're not aware what LaraCast is, it's the premier kind of place to learn Laravel and really all topics, web development, do just an amazing job with, tutorials, Jeffrey and his team over there.

So definitely check that out. It's only $19 a month. They actually have the lifetime deal still. I think it's, like, 3.99 for life, which is what I would do honestly and what I have done, and gotten way more than my fair share out of it. So, thanks to Jeff for reaching out and Laracast for sponsoring the podcast.

Truly appreciate it. If you are interested in sponsoring, definitely let us know on Twitter or you can email us. But, yeah, thanks to Laracasts. And, Aaron, I'm sure you've you've used Laracasts. Right?

Aaron

Ian, come on. Hey.

Ian

Come on.

Aaron

Look at me. Come on.

Ian

Were they a mentor of yours, I assume. Right?

Aaron

Yeah. I'm a, I'm a lifetime member, of course. You know, I purchased many, many, many years ago, and I'm a Lyricast instructor. So I've got a course on there.

Ian

Oh, wait a minute. What course did you do?

Aaron

Get out of here. One on Sidecar. That, open source library that I wrote. So I think it's like a serverless functions or something like that. It's part of the the creator series, which he did, which is, like, people that create libraries.

So, like, I think Jack McDade has a statamic one. I think Caleb did a LiveWire 1, and then I did one on Sidecar. So, yeah, I know there's still a cast.

Ian

Stuff on there now. It's, it's just unbelievable. I mean, they look at all the JavaScript stuff. They got live wire, like you mentioned. It's, you know, way more than Laravel at this point, but, he also just released the Laravel 11 huge series that kind of brings you up the speed on all that.

So definitely check out Lara Casts, if you haven't. If you're somebody out there who hasn't Yeah. For the

Aaron

4 people listening that haven't already bought a

Ian

lifetime membership,

Aaron

please do that. Thank you,

Ian

Jeffrey, for sponsoring us even though you're sponsoring it too, what I'm sure is a a Laracast heavy audience. Yes. We we really appreciate it. And definitely, if you aren't a subscriber, definitely check it out. It helps the show and helps a lot of our community.

So thank you, Laracast. Yes. Alright. We have a little bit of feedback I just wanted to cover, and then you have a lot of stuff to talk about. But, Yeah.

Aaron

It's kinda kind of an emergency pod because, you know, today is Friday, and we're gonna put it out as quickly as we can. And then we got a big one scheduled for Monday, but, you know, the show must go on. Yeah.

Ian

We got kinda fell behind a little bit. I was a little under the weather Monday, but we're catching up now. We got an emergency pod. It's all kinda worked out, actually. So, it's good.

Yep. So we do have a lot of feedback too. I'm gonna all of it's not gonna make it to the show. Sorry to some of you who wrote in, I will write back to some of you, to follow-up anyway, but I do have a full few pieces I pulled out here. Andrew Mason had some feedback.

I thought this was very appropriate. He's like, Hey, we used to talk about Taylor Swift a lot. Taylor Swift, queen of the breakup song. Is Aaron gonna do a breakup song? That's what, that's what he wants to know.

And I don't know. You're gonna bust out? You're gonna do some singing, some dancing?

Aaron

You know you know, I wanna keep many of the listeners that we gained through the layoff story, and so I will not be singing here. But instead,

Ian

we could talk

Aaron

about this in a little bit. Maybe I'll start a a break up company. So maybe that's Oh. Maybe that's my version of T Swift's break up song.

Ian

Not vengeance DB, I I don't think, but something

Aaron

No. No. No. Just just regular vengeance incorporated. Yeah.

Not not a not a database thing at all. Yeah.

Ian

Alright. And then we also had a question from Anthony McClowsky. Just a quick feedback on your sleep stack and how that's going in the, chill pad. Is that what it's called?

Aaron

Chili pad. Yeah.

Ian

Chili pad. They

Aaron

pump chili through it. Yeah. Well, I refuse to call it a sleep stack, because that's very San Francisco, and I think Anthony knows that because I said that on Twitter. So my my sleeping, arrangement, my ritual is going great, Ian. It's going amazing.

Ian

Wow.

Aaron

I'm sleeping through the night. I think a lot of that has to do with the chili pad,

Ian

right,

Aaron

because it is keeping me it is keeping me cold and or cool. You know, the younger twins have started sleeping through the night. I've stopped caffeine, you know, past 11, really, and I've cut back drastically on how much I'm drinking at all. Still off the diet Cokes.

Ian

Oh, wow. Okay.

Aaron

And, occasionally, I'll take some, some CBD before bed. And it, like I feel like all of those things combined have helped me sleep, and I just feel I feel so much better.

Ian

That's awesome. Yeah. When your sleep's off, it's so hard. Just every single other aspect of your life gets way worse when the sleep's off. Everything gets worse.

Aaron

So yeah. Feeling better. Highly recommend the chili pad if you're waking up warm or having trouble regulating the temperature in your room. Very, very recommended.

Ian

Alright. Awesome. Well, I mean, we gotta address what's behind you here. I mean, you're in the Darren Francis studio of light and sound. So

Aaron

am. Yeah.

Ian

Looks like you went a different way than what we saw on Twitter a little bit. On Twitter, you kinda had some shelves and some stuff. I did. Yeah. A little more, kind of just some photos and things.

So give us the scoop. What's going on?

Aaron

Yeah. So I'm in here. I'm in the apartment studio, which is officially the Air and Francis Studio of Light and Sound. And so this wall behind me, if you're not watching on YouTube, this is gonna be real difficult for you. This wall behind me, there's a window behind that wall.

So that's where the false wall, is built, which is just like yeah. It's so awesome. So stupid and so awesome.

Ian

It is. Like, it's one of those things that's totally stupid. It makes no sense, but it's also just amazing and awesome. Yeah. Yeah.

Kind of

Aaron

my that's kind of my A little bit of your shit. Yeah. What is stupid and awesome? And I should do that thing to the uttermost.

Ian

Which I go over the top with.

Aaron

Exactly. So IKEA cabinets, IKEA pegboard. And then right now, I've got I've just got all that art resting on the cabinets or on the countertop. But I think I'll probably you know, I'll hang some of it and make it a little more gallery wall ish, put some books on the countertop. Got my lighting all set up, got a new camera, so I'm finally I'm finally as as 4 k as you are, Ian.

The other camera had 4 k. I just didn't have it enabled. But now I've got this camera with 4 k, and I'm feeling like, god. I gotta really visit a dermatologist. This 4 k is

Ian

too high resolution. The worst. High resolution. Yeah. They're like that.

I'm like, I can

Aaron

scoot back. Like, where I need a I need a blur filter on this thing. Yep. But, yeah, it's it's awesome being here. Like, I'm still smoothie guy, so, you know, I can just walk out to the kitchen, make my smoothie, walk down to the gym, hit the hit the elliptical and the weights for, like, 20 minutes and walk back up.

Private bathroom, little balcony. I can look over the pool. It's like I'm I'm truly living. It's wonderful.

Ian

Yeah. That's great. That's awesome. Yeah. It seems like you've gone for a little more of a is this intentional?

Like, the lighting is something different. It's more of a contract, like a black and white kind of situation, or maybe that's just because of the board. I don't know. There's there's definitely a different vibe.

Aaron

Yeah. This is a different vibe for sure. I went, the old studio was very much or the old room was very much, dark and the background was dark, and there were, like, some neon lights on it and stuff. And this is very clean, very white, and much, much brighter. And that is, that's the aesthetic that I'm going for in here.

And I have a different setting. There's some lights back there. I have a different setting that warms up the whole background, so it makes it a lot moodier. Right. But this is, like, my clean, modern workshop, like Right.

Ian

You're you're in the shop. Working light. Yeah. Exactly. I like Yeah.

It's a little bit different than what other people are doing, which I think is good. Kinda stands out. Yeah.

Aaron

Yeah. That's the goal. And whether or not I put up, you know, those colored, you know, go v lights that I had, I I don't really know. I might I might have a scene that that looks a lot more like gamery. But right now, I'm going for, like, clean professional, not, you know, degenerate gamer.

So You

Ian

could switch it up too. Go go on your vibe. You know? Yeah. Whatever you're feeling.

Aaron

Exactly. If I ever start streaming myself playing, like, Factorio or something, I'll put the neon lights back there again.

Ian

Then you have to.

Aaron

Yeah, pump music, and it'll it'll be great. So, yeah, it's, it's good to be here. I feel like I can work here, which is really nice.

Ian

Commuting is good and all that?

Aaron

Commuting is awesome. It's like from the rent house, it's like 5 minutes. And from the house that we're gonna move into soon, it's like 3 minutes, maybe 2. Wow. You know?

Ian

So what's

Aaron

one and one minute of that is getting up into the apartment garage because, you know, those are a nightmare. So it's awesome. Yeah. I love it.

Ian

And moving to the new house, timeline?

Aaron

Man, who knows? Who knows for sure? Yeah. The carry costs are just through the roof, aren't they?

Ian

Right. Right.

Aaron

So our our lease and the rental is up May 1st, and I think we're gonna extend that to June 30th so we get an extra 2 months. Yep. But I the new house should be done well before then. It's just a matter of, like, we don't wanna super crunch moving because moving is a nightmare and moving with 4 kids Definitely. Is probably a 4 x nightmare.

Maybe it maybe a 40 x nightmare. Yeah.

Ian

It's a big nightmare for sure.

Aaron

Yeah. So they should be done. Cabinets are there. We've picked out countertops. Drywall is up.

So, you know Man. Knowing knowing as much as I know about construction, which is not that much.

Ian

And this is a new house? Is this a new house? No.

Aaron

It's a full remodel.

Ian

Oh, okay. Yeah. Full

Aaron

downstairs remodel. Studs. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

Ian

Okay. That's still a big job.

Aaron

Still a big job, man. Yeah. Count your chicken for the time. Yeah.

Ian

Definitely Yeah.

Aaron

Don't get

Ian

in the couple extra months. Definitely a good idea. Yeah. Never know what might, what might pop up there.

Aaron

No. And, man, can you imagine if it came May 1st and they had a new tenant ready to move into the house we're in and we had nowhere to go, and it was like Yeah. You had one job. You had one job, and it was make sure your family has housing. So I'm just, you

Ian

know, I'm gonna make sure that that is the case. Yeah. You don't wanna have to go somewhere in between, like, trying to all your everybody all of you 6 of you in the studio. That's

Aaron

not gonna work. Way. Yeah. No. Yep.

Yep.

Ian

So I think that's a good call. It's always better to play it safe on these things.

Aaron

Yeah. I think so.

Ian

Cool.

Aaron

Alright. One more one more piece of of follow-up. Last episode last episode, we talked about Kelsey Hightower, and I couldn't remember where he worked. Okay. I got a nice email reminding me that Kelsey Hightower worked at Google.

And interesting, I remember Kelsey Hightower, but not Google. And I think that's like hopefully hopefully, that's the case moving forward as people will remember me and follow me wherever I go. That is the hope. Like we did with Kelsey Hightower, I hope.

Ian

Right. Yeah. I do think that is yeah. Definitely. I remember the people more than the place they work for these kind of folks.

But, yeah, I honestly could I could barely tell you who Kelsey Hightower is, to be honest with you, and I certainly couldn't tell you, where where he worked. So, yes, that is excellent follow-up there. So last we left, it was interview week. So you guys interview after interview. It was stacked and packed.

Aaron

Stacked and packed.

Ian

How'd that go?

Aaron

A day.

Ian

An hour? Half an hour? How are you working these?

Aaron

Half an hour. Yeah. SavvyCal SavvyCal really, really paid for itself here. I I ran everything through SavvyCal. Mhmm.

So shout out to shout out to Derek Reimer and SavvyCal.

Ian

Yep.

Aaron

Yeah. So, you know, I got laid off on a Wednesday. I pushed everybody off until the next week. And so then last week was, was interview week and it was also like a phone call with friends and advisors week, You know?

Ian

Get some advice.

Aaron

So last week, I I had, I think, 39 calls. I looked at my calendar and counted it up. I think it was 39 calls. Yeah. That's wild.

Ian

It's, like, awesome and also terrible at the same time. I'm like Yeah.

Aaron

Yeah. Totally totally awesome and, like, super duper encouraging and also terribly exhausting.

Ian

Right.

Aaron

So I had all these calls, and, there were a lot, like first of all, everyone was incredibly, like, kind and supportive, and it was just, like, it was really kind of, like, a super encouragement to, like, do all of these calls because everybody was like, yeah. We know who you are. You're doing great work. We would love for you to do that with us. Like, really?

I don't have to, like, send you a stupid resume or something?

Ian

No cover letter. No resume. No. Just

Aaron

No. Nothing.

Ian

Just show up.

Aaron

Just like, hey.

Ian

Just be you.

Aaron

You've seen the work you're doing, which

Ian

Yeah.

Aaron

Made that maybe that's a takeaway is

Ian

Which, I mean, yeah, tie that back. Let's tie that back to one of the earliest episodes. And one of the things you talked about and had a great talk on and everything is, like, put the work out there. Like it's such a huge advantage, like to put the work out there and have people know you and have ins with people and connections, whether it's like, obviously you're exhibiting a somewhat extreme case, but even in a smaller case, it's like, you don't need 40 people to call you. You need 2.

Right? So it's just like you make a name for yourself and you're gonna get an opportunity when you need one. Like, that's such a huge thing or someone to just retweet you at the right moment or to share you with their group or whatever. It's like just that little, push just by putting yourself out there a little bit. So yeah.

Yep.

Aaron

I looked back, when I when I applied at Tuple, which was, you know, a few years ago now

Ian

Mhmm.

Aaron

I put together a web page. It's just aaron aaronfrancis.com/tuple, and it's my, like, it's my, you know, resume slash application. And on there, I just said, hey, Ben. Like, here's all the stuff I've done that you can go look at. And I think that's such a, like, that's such a cheat code to have work publicly available so you don't have to be like, I promise I did great stuff at my company that I can't show you, but I you have to trust me.

Having stuff that's like, hey. Look. You can it's out there. It's been out there for a while. I'm not just doing this for your edification.

Like, it's out there. You could go look at it. And if this works, it works.

Ian

So I side a little side quest here as we've been talking about this kind of in personal telegrams with, like, people hiring. And I know Adam Wathan's been talking about it publicly, but it's like people, they don't put in extra effort when they apply for jobs. They don't even read the instructions. So read the instructions

Aaron

see his tweet that said 90% people

Ian

I know. Don't follow

Aaron

the instructions. Yes.

Ian

Yeah. That's like really well. It's one of my same experience. Like, that literally don't follow the instructions and I just instantly discard them. Like they, I want a cover letter.

They don't send a cover letter or they send an obviously just generic cover letter. That's just, I don't even read your resume. I just move on to the next thing. And so right there, if you just do that little extra work of like a cover letter, so this is just something that's applicable, not internet, fancy startup shit, just like generic big co. They almost always want some kind of cover letter or cover email, whatever.

Like, just do that. Like just literally do a good job on that. And yes, that is already a huge step and then follow any instructions Alright. That you're already at, like, the 5 percentile of, like, people and what they're doing. And then, yeah, I think certainly for jobs you're really interested in, especially at smaller companies, like what you did for Tupelo, going that extra extra step, which is still not a huge step.

I mean, this we'll put a link in the show notes to your page. I mean, it's not like you spent 2 days on this website and stuff flying all over and it's like 2 special. Like this is just like addressed to the founder. A nice little paragraph, some links to your shit. Like, that's it.

It took you probably half an hour, an hour, whatever. And, and that right there is gonna make a huge impression. And and that was a job you were hired for, we should say, for people who don't know. So it actually worked.

Aaron

It was.

Ian

Yeah. And it's great.

Aaron

It's like that's gonna

Ian

make you stand out.

Aaron

During the interview process, one of, the pieces of feedback I got from Ben was, who is, you know, was the CEO of Tuple. He said that, like, a bunch of people just DM ed him, like, 15 different links. And he really appreciated that I put it all together in a nice digestible format for him. And like I, it took you you're right. It took me 30 minutes, and I just Yeah.

Put a very simple page up. But it shows I think it shows that, like, hey. I want the job. I thought about this. I thought about what might be easiest for you, and here it is.

Ian

So I mean, it's the core principle of selling anything. Like, the easier it is to buy, the faster and easier it gets bought. And so when you're selling yourself, you wanna make yourself easy to buy and putting all the information in one spot in a digestible format with appropriate explanation, following the rules people want, like, that just makes you easier to hire than Yep. The person who's just like, here's all my shit in the DM and, like, yeah, here's some Or or

Aaron

the just like, hire me. I would love to work there. It's like, okay. And?

Ian

Here's a link to my GitHub with 200 projects in it. Like, how do I know which is the one that you actually want me to like, really the, the, the 5 minutes I'm gonna give you, like, which is the one you want me to really dig into? Oh, as opposed to like, look through these 200 things you've forked over a 1000000 years and, like, let me figure out which one's actually important. Like, so, yeah, all those little things I think I think we push one of

Aaron

these buttons here.

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. We are. We can do a whole episode on that. I, last time I hired, like, last year, I was just like, I mean, I was just like throwing shit in the office.

It's just like, it's crazy. And like, we had like 100 of applicants, and we really only had, like, a couple of actual serious people that were even, like, worth interviewing, to be honest you. Like, I think I did end up doing, like, 4 interviews, and only a couple were even really good. And we ended up with somebody great, so that's that's great. But, it worked out.

But it's still like, man, you go through all this stuff, all these people wasting this little amount. Why even waste your time? Like, why waste your time with this little 5 minutes you're wasting by not following the instructions and doing a poor job. So, yeah, it's just like, why do I want somebody who's gonna do a poor job at presenting themselves to me for a job? That's Yeah.

Gonna pay.

Aaron

Not a good start.

Ian

A 100,000

Aaron

dollars more than that. Yeah.

Ian

So, yeah. So, anyway,

Aaron

alright.

Ian

So you so you went to 30 something in the news.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

Yeah. I I got the juice flowing. Were there any of the I obviously, you're not probably gonna go into specific people, but, like, were there some that stood out more than others? I mean, give us just a little flavor of that.

Aaron

We got to know a little more. Taste. Yeah.

Ian

Yeah.

Aaron

Yeah. There was definitely some that stood out more than others, and there were some, you know, there were some that were, like, this kinda seems interesting, but it's not really, like, it's not really my area of expertise and, like, not really my area that I wanna get super into, frankly.

Ian

Mhmm.

Aaron

And so there were several like that where it was like, hey. This person that I'm talking to is great, and the company has an awesome reputation, but it's just something that, like, I can't see myself getting really excited about. Yeah. And so there were a few of those. But, you know, most of them were most of them were basically around the same, like, hey.

We kinda want you to come and do the same thing Do your thing. At our company. Yeah. Come do your thing. And we actually, Steve and I took a few joint calls together and, like, we'd love to have both of you come.

Like, we wanna hire you both right now.

Ian

Wow.

Aaron

Which, yeah, is is awesome. And, like, I would love to keep the band together, which we are.

Ian

So So Go ahead. Foreshadowing. Foreshadowing.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

Before we get all the way to that, were all of these, like, job offers, full time job offers? Were there people who are like, hey. We just want a contract with you, or what was that?

Aaron

So there there were some that were like, hey. We we don't have a full time spot right now, but we would love for you to create content for us. I'm like, no. That sounds that sounds great. Some some said, hey.

I don't have a job at all for you, but I want, like, I wanna talk. And so that was, you know, that was just nice of of people to to reach out. You know, many of them were, like, we want you full time on the dev ed team or dev rel team, doing doing the same kind of thing. You know, some people ask me, like, what is developer relations? And I was like, I don't know.

I mean, it is nice because I could just be on totally honest and people, you know, in these interviews and people are like, what's developer relations? No idea. I'm a developer educator, and that's that's what I wanna do. I'm like, oh, wow. Good answer.

I'm like, great. Thanks. Because I didn't know the answer to your the question you asked.

Ian

That's so funny.

Aaron

Yeah. So there was, you know, there was some stuff like that. Some people were like, some people did, like, a formal interview, and they're, like, can you tell me what this word means or, like, this abbreviation industry abbreviation means.

Ian

Interesting. Okay.

Aaron

Yeah. One of them was, like, new SQL, n e w SQL. Like, what it what is new SQL? And I said, I'll be honest. I have no idea what new SQL is.

I know what no sequel is. Yeah. I don't know what my sequel is. I have no idea what new sequel is.

Ian

Man, we gotta invent something like that on this show. We gotta invent some words. Yeah. We need some word invention.

Aaron

I know. We need some shibboleths.

Ian

Did you ever find out what

Aaron

That's old testament. Do you know shibboleth, Ian?

Ian

No. I don't think I do. Oh, wow. I don't think I do. I'm not as studied as I should be.

Aaron

This is a great one. So

Ian

Okay. Give it to us.

Aaron

I'm gonna all all of the biblical scholars out there are gonna just cringe as I butcher my way through this. In the old testament, you know, because there are good guys, bad guys. Right? You

Ian

know? Right.

Aaron

Whoever you know, Israelites always the good guys.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

God's chosen people. So there was this there was this point where they were, like, trying to weed out some spies or whatever from a foreign land, of course. And there's a specific word that these this people group couldn't say, like, couldn't pronounce correctly, and the word was shibboleth. And so that became, like, the pass code at at the city gates was you would have to say the shibboleth. And so now now it's become, like, if we I'm just gonna Google.

I love googling definitions on the show. Shivaluff.

Ian

Give it to us. Yeah.

Aaron

Here we go.

Ian

We love the law. It's real power.

Aaron

Just freaking I got another one. I got I got the t totalar last time, and this time I got shibboleth. Here's shibboleth, a custom principle or belief distinguishing a particular class or group of people, especially a long standing one regarded as outmoded or no longer important. So you could say, like, we have a shibboleth, and that's like, oh, we have a secret a secret code, a

Ian

secret secret code language.

Aaron

And so we need we need more shibboleths on the show. So there you go. There's your word study for the day. There's a little bit of biblical history.

Ian

Away. I have to say I was, I was raised Jewish and but I never called them going through this.

Aaron

No. Remember shibboleth?

Ian

No. I don't think I got to that. I don't think we got to that. So now I know.

Aaron

Let's see if I can give people a reference here. No. Not not really quickly. Oh, shit.

Ian

Phone off on my old phone.

Aaron

Sign on single sign on login system for computer.

Ian

Of course.

Aaron

Oh, we're we're

Ian

everybody's out of domains. It's like, hey. We're gonna I know. I'm the old testament for domain names that are available.

Aaron

For, like, an off company shibboleth. That's amazing. Yeah.

Ian

We use the shibboleth. Dislike everything about that for a company name. I just think it's all Really?

Aaron

Just all good.

Ian

It's it's not good. It's Nobody's getting this.

Aaron

Get it. Nobody has any idea. Nobody can spell it.

Ian

Nobody can spell it. Nobody can say it. You're bringing this whole religious component in, which I don't Exactly. Can of worms. Like, there's a lot I don't like about that.

So don't actually do that. If you're a VC

Aaron

Don't do that.

Ian

Do that with the VC money. The VC money, you wanna Yeah.

Aaron

That's fine.

Ian

Take a flyer. That's fine. But with your own money, you you don't wanna do that.

Aaron

Oh, okay. You wanna get real metal? Here's the actual here's here's the passage it comes from in Judges 12. This is Yeah. This is old testament, so it's, like, it's wild.

Ian

Fire and brimstone stuff here.

Aaron

Oh, yeah. So it's the Gileadites and yada yada yada. The man of the Gilead the man of Gilead said to him,

Ian

I'm the Ephraimite.

Aaron

And they said, say the word Shibboleth, and he said Shibboleth, for he could not pronounce it right. They took him and slew him in the passages of Jordan. So oh, it gets worse. There and there fell at the time of the Ephraimites 42,000. So, yeah, you gotta say shibboleth right, or you're gonna get slewn at the gates of the Jordan.

Ian

Yeah. You gotta have the secret passcode.

Aaron

That's so cool.

Ian

Looking for it. Yo. People wanted us to do a, call in show Yeah. Which we might still do at some point. I think we should.

Interesting. I'm like in this whole biblical spin off show where we just go through, like, old and new testament passages. Maybe we get some the Quran in there. Like, we just go through with some Buddhism. Like, we just, like we start doing religious angles on things, and that's

Aaron

our other question. Provide the in house scholarship on on the Bible, but I I I don't have the evidence covered. So we need that

Ian

call in. We could bring

Aaron

it we need to have

Ian

the call in. Yeah. That we need to do that because that's how you the audience. Right? We'll have the call ins.

It's fine.

Aaron

Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ian

I like it straight.

Aaron

Well, yeah, we'll add it to the add it to the notes for the call in

Ian

show. Yeah.

Aaron

So I told her I said to the interviewer, I don't know Yeah. What new sequel is, but have you heard of Shibboleth? Because I know what that word means.

Ian

Oh, did you actually say this?

Aaron

I know.

Ian

That would have been awesome if you did that.

Aaron

Oh, it would have been amazing. So the interviews, you know, most of them. Hold on.

Ian

Hold on. What is new sequel? Like, Informa? Did you go look it up after?

Aaron

I have no idea. No clue. No clue. Yeah. No.

No idea. I think it's something that someone is trying to, like, trying to make happen.

Ian

Like, that's Right.

Aaron

I don't know. Yeah. I don't know if it's gonna happen.

Ian

Trying too hard.

Aaron

I think so. New sequel. I don't yeah.

Ian

I'm not buying it.

Aaron

So, you know, lots of them were just regular phone calls, like, with, you know, CEOs or VPs of DevRel or whatever.

Ian

Right.

Aaron

And so they weren't super formal. Yep. But, yeah, it was it was it was great. And I kinda left everyone, at that point, I left everyone by saying like, hey, I'm gonna take a whole bunch of calls and, there's a chance that I'd end up taking no jobs, but I will definitely, like, I'll definitely consider everything. And, you know, I did.

I think there were a lot of great opportunities, but nothing that just, like, nothing that really moved me. You know? I think Yeah. Part of me thought I could go and do this same thing again. Like, I could go run it back, and probably it would work.

But I think my overwhelming feeling was if if I ever want to, like, go on my own and give this thing, like, the real college try, now is now is the moment. Like, I don't wanna miss I don't wanna miss the window. I don't wanna ride the hype over the top. Like, I don't wanna lose the momentum. Right.

And I think if I went and worked somewhere I think if I went and worked somewhere, like, 3 months in, I would be like, man, I could have gone for it. I could have made it. And it this is just this is just so perfect because I it's like I am the aggrieved party. Like, I did my job. I executed my duties faithfully.

I think the record will show it was a huge success, and then I got let go. So it's not like, you know, it's not like I'm the bad guy, and I became like, I weaseled my way into being the face of planet scale and then left them high and dry, and now I'm gonna contract them for $1,000,000. Like, that would have been clever, actually. But I I got let go. And so it's like, great.

No fault. No fault in my own. Now's the time.

Ian

If you took a job, you might actually end up in that spot. Like, you take the job Yes. You're unhappy, then you go start your own thing. And it's sort of like that. Well, now I'm taking this audience and I'm like going over here, like,

Aaron

and you could, I could like, it's sorta like a, Yeah. A black eye to be like, Hey, I'm going to go take a job and then realize I don't want to do this. But I've already, like, made a bunch of videos for some new company. And then 3 or 6 months in, I'm like, sorry. That like, Oh, that feels that feels bad to me.

Ian

I think you're totally right about momentum. I feel like I mean, just like from a straight sort of I don't like the word content. I'm actually very negative on the word content, but from a content perspective, you know, there is momentum. People are interested in your story right now and like going off into the bowels of some $1,000,000,000 companies, like an unsatisfying ending to that story to be honest with you. Like, I mean, it's a good ending for you and their family, so that would be fine.

Like, Aaron's taken care of. Great.

Aaron

But, like But it's bad content, Ian.

Ian

I don't need I don't need to follow on to that. It's like, yeah. Now you're going to do videos somewhere else. Whatever. Who cares?

That's fine. And so this is a much more intriguing story that you're gonna apparently, go out and, try your, put your hat into the market.

Aaron

That's right. Apparently. Yeah. I I feel like this is the most entertaining option.

Ian

Like, this is for the podcast. I mean, I'll tell you that.

Aaron

Best for the

Ian

podcast. You know,

Aaron

now that we have a sponsor, we could Yeah. We could live for many handfuls of days. Maybe

Ian

Jeffrey was generous Yeah. To be honest. Exactly. Jeffrey was generous. So

Aaron

I think this is, like, this is this is the most exciting outcome, the most entertaining outcome, and the one that I feel the best about is not taking not taking full time work. Yeah. And so that's where I landed.

Ian

Limited energy. You know, it's not you're not 25 and you're not, single or married with no kids. Like, nope. So you have to start being selective. I mean, even when we started the podcast, you were kind of on the, like, try everything and see what sticks.

Mhmm. But I do think there ultimately is a, like, you kind of have to narrow it down a little bit. And even though I'm sure you're still gonna be doing a lot of different things, like ultimately, like, you can really probably only have one very big thing. Like, sure, you can have a podcast, and you can make some personal videos, and you could do side stuff like that, but you're not gonna be able to, like, do a bunch of you're not gonna be able to go work at big corp and also do heavy on your own stuff. I don't think that's that realistic.

Like, you could do it a little bit of this and that, you know, but, like, maybe you could take a consulting gig here and there, but you're not gonna be able to grind consulting gigs every night after work and work No. And do a good job at all that and everything. Like, it's just too hard. So yeah. So I think this is a like like we talked about before, it's a good time for you to give it a shot.

You did your due diligence. It sounds like there was Yep. Nothing that bold you over, but, maybe some people you'll work with in the future and some way or another potentially.

Aaron

Hopefully, some people that I can go back to. Actually, I've already, you know, emailed everyone. Hopefully, these people will be like, yeah. Sounds great. Honestly, I I have already gotten maybe 4 or 5 emails back from these companies, and every single one of them has been, like, I'm really excited for you.

That's awesome, and you should

Ian

do it. That's great.

Aaron

We would love to work together.

Ian

That's that's

Aaron

cool. Awesome. Best possible outcome. Right.

Ian

So, I don't actually know what you're doing. I know just the highest level of what you're doing, that you're going out

Aaron

and you're vibes.

Ian

Yeah. We're just vibes. Yeah. That's what we do. Vibes.

That's how we like to do it. We we like it to be fresh. Yep. So why don't you give it to us? What's the plan?

Aaron

What's the offering? What are we going to market with? Yes. So here's the deal. Steve and I, formerly known as Steve the editor, which is, you know, it's a bit.

It's it's funny. It it it plays well. Now, producer Steve.

Ian

He's not Steve the editor.

Aaron

Yeah. He's not Steve the editor. That was always I was always pigeonholing him for the sake of humor. Producer Steve. Producer Steve and I are going out on our own together.

Wow. We're a partner. A partner. Okay. Yeah.

As a as a unit. Okay. So Steve came in town. He lives in Boise, Idaho Yep. With Nathan Berry.

I mean, he doesn't live with Nathan Berry,

Ian

but I would be that would be awesome if he actually

Aaron

lived with Nathan.

Ian

Yeah.

Aaron

Yeah. That would be awesome.

Ian

You're dropping news breaking news.

Aaron

Yeah. He lives in Nathan's back house. So he lives in Boise. He came in town Sunday, Monday, Tuesday of this week. Mhmm.

And Steve and I filmed a video. Steve is, like, I thought, you know, I thought, like, oh, I I love video. No. Steve's a video. Steve props so much gear.

He Yeah. Oh, he's so deep. Yeah. So much gear, and, like, I'll show you some or I'll treat some, you know, behind the scenes photos of all the lights that he set up. Right.

Dude would spend, like, an hour setting up lights, and then we would take a, you know, a 30 second take. And it it it worked. Like, it it Yeah. It's good because it looks amazing.

Ian

Right. Yeah. Though that extra work always pays off or usually pays off.

Aaron

So cool. Like, working with an actual professional,

Ian

it's very fun. Person like that. That's really cool. Yeah. Like, how the physical space set up and everything.

Aaron

Uh-huh. Yeah. He rented he rented an Airbnb, and we did a lot of the filming there. Like, he, you know, looked for one that looked cool and modern, and then we did a lot of the filming there. We did some filming here at the studio.

Ian

So it's gonna be like a splash video or that that type of thing. Okay.

Aaron

By the time you're listening to this, dear listener, the video will be out. Okay. So go to my Twitter to see it. Aaron defrances. The video is, you know, it's it's a hero's journey.

Right? So that starts with, I got laid off, and then it goes through me it goes through me being sad, and so, like, I did a bunch of different shots of, 1, I'm at

Ian

the pool.

Aaron

I'm just gonna tell you because everybody hopefully will have seen it at this point, and I think it's hysterical. One, I'm at the pool here at the, here at the apartment. I'm at the pool reading accounting accounting for dummies, so I'm reading a big book. I'm just, you know, sitting there enjoying that. One shot, I'm in the gym, but I'm sipping an iced coffee and looking at my phone while I'm, like, very slowly on the elliptical.

One shot, I'm, like, surrounded by Diet Cokes, watching TV, and then the camera goes behind me, and you can see that I'm watching Fast and Furious. So it's just, like Oh, there

Ian

we go.

Aaron

Perfect. Hysterical. And there's there's maybe 1 or 2 others that I don't remember. So that's, like, the first half, and then it turns with, like, me realizing I should go out on my own. And then it's like the, you know, monologue, and then at the end The inspirational.

Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. And then at the end, it's like the description of what we're offering. So to that end, what are we offering?

So here's here's the thing. I think there are going to be, I think there are going to be 2 2, 2 legs to our offering. 1 is going to be in house first party courses that we produce and sell. Right. So that's gonna be that's gonna be our own product, and I think, you know, that can take the shape of a Laravel Eloquent course, which I will begin working on immediately, and lots of ideas for database courses.

Yep. And so we'll have kind of this this in house brand that's like database education. Best best database education in the world for developers, not DBAs. That's kinda Now

Ian

let's talk about ties into that too so strongly because it's just like the whole the whole database stack, so to

Aaron

speak, from, like,

Ian

using it in your code down through understanding what the hell you're doing inside the database. Yep.

Aaron

So I think I think that's, like, a real opportunity for us is I do an Eloquent course, and then I do a MySQL course and a Postgres course and SQLite course. Yep. And the, the developer can come and say, like, yeah. I'm a Laravel developer, and our driver or our database is Postgres, and so I'm gonna buy these two courses together and learn everything I need to know. So staying off of the monthly subscriptions for that, just like you buy a course

Ian

that it's your time,

Aaron

you're not expecting updates from us. Mhmm. Because it's, you know, it's databases and I'm like, I can't be on the hook to produce a new novel piece of like valuable content for you to pay for every week.

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. So I think that makes sense.

Aaron

That's the first party in house stuff that we're gonna try to build up as as we have time to, like, cushion

Ian

the rest

Aaron

of it.

Ian

Side note there too. The databases themselves do give you an eloquent, gives you these opportunities to like relaunch them all the time too. Because it's like every year to 2 years, right. It's gonna be like big database update in my SQL or post grads or big Laravel update that adds a bunch of stuff. And so like that, it'll give you that, like, you could turn it into recurring revenue of a sort.

Right? Totally. Like, hey, we're relaunching the Eloquent course again because it's been 18 months and there's all kinds of new hotness. And Yep. You know, even if you give the update for free to existing customers or however you wanna work that, but, like, you're just getting the opportunity to relaunch it all the time, especially since you'd be working on on it full time and not just like you did it, but now you got busy.

And so it just kinda get dusty. It's like, no, you can like set aside a month and refresh it all and make it all magically new and add the new stuff, and then we launch that whole ABBY account.

Aaron

Have a big launch event. Yeah.

Ian

Yep. Yeah. You know,

Aaron

every time Laravel releases a new version, I can have another big launch sale or whatever. Yeah. I think Yep. I think there's a lot of room there. And I think, honestly, even partnering with partnering with guest instructors for, like, Ruby's active record.

Yeah. Or Rails' active record, or even Prisma. The the problem with Prisma and Drizzle, the JS ORMs is they just changed so much that I feel a little I feel a little hesitant about that.

Ian

Yeah. Well, that's a lot. You have a lot to do. So if you kind of cover if you cover Laravel, maybe with a guest for rails and then you get on database stuff, I mean, that's That's a net risk there.

Aaron

Hopefully enough enough. Yeah. Money and things to worry about. Yeah. So that is that's the one leg.

That's the products for dollars, classic business. The other the other leg is, services for dollars. And so, the the initial offering here is actually, it's also twofold. But the initial offering on the consulting side is, one, we will come alongside your in house existing dev ed, DevRel teams where you're already investing, are not just simply not working. Yep.

So we'll do, you know, we'll do an audit, and then there will be, you know, some sort of ongoing retainer of, like, let's make your videos work better. Yeah. And that starts from coming up with ideas to framing the ideas to recording to editing to packaging to releasing all the way through. And so instead of instead of, like, me being the on camera person, you have an on camera person, and we work behind the scenes with that person, to make them more effective. Yep.

And then the enterprise offering is you want us to make a whole entire course for you with me being on camera? Great. Contact sales. Let's let's do that.

Ian

Right. And

Aaron

that starts at not insignificant amounts of money. Right.

Ian

Right. Yeah. Because if it's gonna, if we assume that these courses will do at least okay, then this consulting stuff has, is like fighting for your time there to some degree. So like, I do think, I really like these consulting offerings. I feel like these are the like high level we talked about a couple weeks ago.

It's like, don't get down in the trenches. And if you're going, if they're going to put you down in the trenches, that's actually maybe even more money. Right. Because it's like, not just you coming up with the big idea. It's like you executing the idea, which now is all that extra work and yeah, And everything.

So, I think that makes a ton of sense. And I think you could also position that as even if it's like it's like the big series to kick off your content marketing or something like that. Right? It's like, even if it's like, yeah, we're gonna do 10 videos or whatever the right number is, and you're gonna stretch that out over 3 months or 6 months, and it's gonna, like, lead to x y z and, like, get get you started and don't start from 0 or things like that. Let the experts kinda get it going and yeah.

So I like that. You could even have your own on air talent at some point too. I could imagine, you know, if that, if that gets, you know

Aaron

Mhmm.

Ian

Popular and there's enough companies looking to do it, it's like, it doesn't have to all be you even, and you could still sell it if you can find the the talent. So

Aaron

Yep. I think that's exactly right. And I'll I'll be curious, like, this is what I just pitched you is hopefully the worst version of this that it will ever be. And so, you know, we've already had several people, like, reply and say, hey. We'd love to be your first client.

Let's talk. And so those conversations are going to tell us what does the market actually want. Yep. And it it could end up being that the market actually just really wants high quality editing. And it's like, alright.

Well, that's way different than what we thought. And if if it's, like, if it is sustainable, maybe we maybe we do that. Or may they may want something else that's not even on our radar, but they come to us and, like, this is actually our our burning problem. Great.

Ian

We can

Aaron

do that. So I think this is a like, I think this is a, well informed starting position based on all the conversations we've had with people. It's like, this is what they need, and they're kind of Yeah. They're kind of, like, beating down the door, frankly, to to get us to help them. And it it feels it feels so different.

It feels Yeah. So different from when, like, I spent, you know, a 1000 years trying to do this SaaS thing, and, like, everybody was like, I don't get it, man. And now Right. Now these CEOs are literally like, hey. Congrats.

I love that you're going on your own. Can we talk next week about being your first client?

Ian

Can I throw some money at you? Yeah.

Aaron

Oh, yeah. This is what it feels like. So Yep. I think it's gonna be good.

Ian

I like it. And I definitely, my advice from what you said, I like everything. The only thing I would say be cautious about is I actually don't love that idea of if they push you down into, like, you're just editing, I think that's a bad route. Like Yeah.

Aaron

It feels that's, like, low value. Right?

Ian

Into, like, yeah, like, you're not the value add there is ultimately low, even though Steve is obviously a high end editor

Aaron

compared to who you're

Ian

going to get on the

Aaron

other book. The thing. We would have to hire other editors.

Ian

So you get into that. Like, so I do feel like, like there's so much more value farther up the chain and you have all these leads already. It's like, don't go down the chain unless you really need to, or unless it's like the add on to like, yes, like you're paying us big number X. Yes.

Aaron

Part of

Ian

that is of course, for smaller number Y we can edit this all for you and whatever, and that's that's all great. Like, that makes it a whole one service. Right? And that's that's awesome. But Yeah.

Yeah. I think we're

Aaron

gonna stay away from, like, I've I've actually seen

Ian

the all type stuff.

Aaron

Yeah. I've seen, you know, design joy, the guy that everybody hates, the guy that's doing a $1,000,000. Yeah. So Like, everybody thinks he's

Ian

lying, but it's not clear. Like, if he is lying or not. I don't know if he Who

Aaron

knows if he's lying? Turns out he's just kinda mean regardless. So Right. Yeah. So I I've seen some, like, video editing, done in a DesignJoy way, where it's, like, you know, you pay $5,000 a month and you get unlimited edits, but only one at a time and with 48 hour turnaround.

And that just feels like that feels to me like a race to the bottom Right. And not something I super wanna be a part of. And, also, like like you said, the lowest possible value offering coming in after the fact, after the content has been decided, after the positioning has been decided, after a Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I'll I'll try to stay

Ian

with that. Point. It's hard to fix it. If it's ill conceived to begin with, the editing's not going to fix that. So, yeah, I think that sounds awesome.

I mean, it's it's a lot even as it is because I could imagine you guys just going just on the just on the courses and right and going hard on just that for a year and Yeah. Without the consulting end. But I do all I totally see the value in the consulting end. And I think that's also great, especially if like, you know, these first couple, you do a really great job and have like that show piece for like other people to then build on, that you can do this, you know, just prove that you can execute this outside of kind of the one company, right. Is I think a big thing and will be important.

But, yeah, it's, I mean, yeah. Thank you. Nailed it. I mean, this all makes so much sense. You just, we didn't talk about screencasting, but you're screencasting.com, that obviously can be a big bump of ASH layer.

Aaron

Yeah. That's like the, I think that's like the fully down market version of our consulting offering. So you come you come to the consulting site, and it's like it starts at some obscene number, and you're like, oh, shoot. Well, I'm an individual. Well, if you're an individual, we'll funnel you off to screencasting where you can do a self paced course on how to make good video.

So I think it all, like, all of all of the vectors are coming together, and I think it'll, like, it'll make a nice, neat package of we can serve you from individual level all the way up to public company level Yep. Just based on, you know, what you need.

Ian

Yeah. It's gonna be really fascinating to watch, like, which parts take off, which parts you have trouble with, like, which parts, or is it all just going gangbusters? That's its own problem, as well. So, so so it's gonna be you and Steve. It sounds like he has a official formalized company partnership.

Anybody else to start your thinking or do you have anybody else in mind? You're gonna start just you 2.

Aaron

Just gonna start with us 2.

Ian

That makes sense.

Aaron

And yeah, it's gonna be it's gonna be, like, the division of, division of responsibilities, I think, is gonna be pretty nice because Steve Steve has a lot of experience in the, like, alright. Let's negotiate a a contract for video stuff. Like, he's been he could do that in his sleep. And, you know, I'll talk to Steve, and I'm like, hey. Maybe we should, you know, start this offering at x $1,000, and he's like, no.

We should double it. I'm like, great. That's why I

Ian

like Steve.

Aaron

I like Steve already. Your contract, guys,

Ian

Steve. Yeah. And You're the marketing. He's sales. Exactly.

Like that exact Like that makes sense.

Aaron

Exactly. And, it's nice because he's, like, he's working on the website right now. He's a developer too, and so he's Oh, okay.

Ian

You know, setting up he's

Aaron

setting up the website. I think it could end up being that, Steve handles some of these strategy calls by himself while I work on courses behind the scenes. And so there could be a nice there could be a nice division of responsibility there. Yep. So, yeah, that's why that's why I'm, like, really excited to do it with Steve instead of on my own because Yeah.

He's, like, he's extremely talented in many different areas. And, like, should we, in a few years, stumble across some SaaS idea that serves our existing business? Yeah, he could, you know, he could do that too. So it's like there are infinitely many options, and we just need to figure out what does what does the market want and how do we fulfill it.

Ian

And is he gonna be full time?

Aaron

Mhmm.

Ian

Yep. Okay.

Aaron

We're both doing the thing. We're I

Ian

love it.

Aaron

We're doing it for real.

Ian

Yeah. I love having a partner. I know part people get down on partners. I just think it's it's really beneficial if you can find the right partner.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

Because just like that, the vision of labor, you just get so much more done or you're having a down period. They're up. They're they're down. You're up. Or you're both firing on all cylinders and twice as much as getting done or 4 times as much as getting done sometimes.

So it's very, very nice, when you can find the right person. And since you guys have worked together, it's even nicer because you at least know you get along and you have a reasonable working relationship, at least, obviously, this will be different and strain it in different ways, I'm sure. But ultimately, you at least have that a little bit of, prior experience there in history.

Aaron

So Yeah. And this this weekend, this past weekend when he came in town was the first time we'd, you know, ever met in person. We spent hours on on Zoom calls, but we never met in person.

Ian

The area.

Aaron

It's awesome. It's great. He's way taller than I expected.

Ian

He's 65. Interesting. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

I thought

Aaron

I might

Ian

have guessed that. Yes.

Aaron

I know. He told me that I'm taller than he expected, and I was like, man, do I have short guy energy? Like, that's that's too bad. I don't wanna be I don't wanna be a little guy on the Internet, but, yeah, he's he's fully 65. It's crazy.

Ian

You're you're, like, sick my height. Right? Are you, like,

Aaron

621? I'm 61 and a half, depending on who

Ian

I was to be.

Aaron

Oh, you thought I was taller?

Ian

Big guy energy. Yeah. I thought you were taller.

Aaron

Oh, man.

Ian

Yeah. And I've met you in person. I thought you were taller. You came off taller in person.

Aaron

Alright. That's great. How tall are you?

Ian

64.

Aaron

64. Wow. Yeah. Maybe I should wear lifts. Should I wear lifts?

Ian

Go you should get 66. Yeah. Why not? Just like big big seventies disco.

Aaron

Catch on to that.

Ian

Maybe 6 maybe 62

Aaron

and a half. I could I could do 62 and a half with some boots

Ian

that have

Aaron

a nice heel on it.

Ian

Cowboy boots. Yeah. You got Exactly. Dallas. You could do cowboy boots.

Aaron

I don't have cowboy boots. You don't know me at all. I don't have cowboy boots.

Ian

What are you

Aaron

talking about?

Ian

I'm about a cowboy hat. What?

Aaron

I don't have a cowboy hat. What am I going to do to the cowboy?

Ian

How is the cost of living in Dallas?

Aaron

Do you know what Dallas is? Dallas is a major. Texas. Metroplex. Yeah.

It's not Fort Worth. A cowboy hat. I don't have a cowboy hat.

Ian

This is ridiculous. I don't like anything about it.

Aaron

This is not ridiculous.

Ian

Conversation has taken a terrible turn.

Aaron

Steve actually Cowboy hat. Steve came over for dinner, and he when he came over, he met Jennifer. And he hit that point. He was like, I really thought y'all were gonna have, like, accents. I thought y'all were gonna have real full on accents.

Ian

Right.

Aaron

Nah. Not really.

Ian

You have a little, but you don't have, like, a heavy accent yet.

Aaron

It's not

Ian

I don't

Aaron

have a I don't have a East Texas accent. That's where it gets real bad. Okay. That's the I could go honestly, I could I could go for a little more Matthew McConaughey accent. Like, that's cool.

Ian

I can

Aaron

dig that leap.

Ian

Into that a little bit.

Aaron

Yeah. I know. I need I need, like, a dialect coach or something. Right. So I'll look into that later.

That's a good use of money right

Ian

now, getting a dialect coach while I'm unemployed. Hey. You're on a talent. You need these things.

Aaron

Here's here's the plan. We're launching we're launching the video today.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

And so right after we get off this call, the video is going to be launched, and the hook is like the hook is I got laid off, and here's what I'm doing next. And so Yep. I'm gonna put it on Twitter. I'm gonna put it on a new YouTube channel, and the call to action yeah. The call to action is going to be, like, get in touch.

Just send us an email. We have a website. The name of the studio so the name of, like, everything that we're doing is called Dry Hard Studios.

Ian

Okay. I like that. Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

So Do you

Ian

like that?

Aaron

Yep. So, tryhardstudios.com, and, the plan is to just launch this video and then see what happens. I mean, we already have, truly, we already have a call set up, to do consulting with the company that

Ian

Right.

Aaron

Wanted to hire both of us. But hopefully, we get more of those calls set up. Yeah. Hopefully, we get more of those calls set up and just kinda, like, figure it out.

Ian

It's It's

Aaron

all I got.

Ian

You're gonna have to come up with, like, processes for that too. You know? I could see there being a lot of work around, like, formalizing these engagements and what are the actual steps you want to go through when doing these things and all that stuff. And that'll be like material you have to create and things over time. So it sounds like you're gonna start with the consulting end as, like, the first push.

Aaron

Yeah. So make sense. I think, like, the first several weeks, I I will primarily be researching and producing this eloquent course. Okay. While, hopefully, Steve is Steve is, like, fielding calls and figuring out what people want and need, and how we how we offer that.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

So the hope is the hope is that we can get this course done and launched relatively quickly and get, like, our big influx of company cash. Like, we both, you know, individually have runways,

Ian

but it would

Aaron

be nice to have, like exactly. It'd be nice to do a fundraise from customers buying a course, basically.

Ian

I like that. I like that. Yeah. What, what about, I don't know. I am a little surprised about a new YouTube channel rather than like utilizing your YouTube channel.

What's your thinking there? So, I mean, I guess, I mean, I get the general idea, but at the same time,

Aaron

do you

Ian

have a big YouTube channel?

Aaron

I do. Yeah. Which we will continue to use. So the YouTube channel that I have, will continue to host developer content. So I will continue to make videos.

I'll just now do it with Steve, with Steve's support. And so the things that are you know, that is being rolled in to this company. And then the new YouTube channel is basically it's more of, like, a lifestyle behind the scenes, make a video when we can or want to, like, talking about everything else. So what I don't wanna do because I would get penalized for it is mix, like, mix the messages on my personal channel.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

So personal will remain fully development, and the we try hard

Ian

channel insights here. Yeah. The algo. There's all about the algo.

Aaron

That's exactly right. So the new we try hard channel is gonna be much more like a creator channel where we talk about building a business and making videos and stuff like that. And that's probably, like, you know, 4th or 5th or 6th on the list of things that's important. But it's a good it's a good outlet to have,

Ian

you know, that kind

Aaron

of content.

Ian

Viewing your personal channel, I would assume as like one of the primary marketing channels. But it's just, then you'll have this other channel for what marketing, but also other stuff. It might not be as big as your personal channel for some time, presumably. But, okay.

Aaron

Yep.

Ian

What do you think give me your top couple fears or challenges or however you wanna approach that question.

Aaron

Claustrophobia has got to be number 1.

Ian

Oh, claustrophobia.

Aaron

Spaces. Yeah. You're talking specifically about the upcoming business change

Ian

or just in general? Business, but if you wanna

Aaron

give us a general fair that makes that makes way more sense. Okay. So past claustrophobia, I think I I don't think we're gonna have trouble generating an initial interest. Mhmm. And so that's, like, a huge a huge leg up, honestly, that we can Right.

Have people to talk to. I think one of one of my fears is figuring or not being able to figure out how to transmute the value to these companies.

Ian

Yeah.

Aaron

So, like, the proof is gonna be in the pudding. If we can come in and make your on air talent 10 times more effective, I'm gonna feel great about that. And I really think we can do it. But there is a fear that we're gonna not be able to, like, figure out what the offering is. Yeah.

And then I think the second one is maybe not in any order. Another one is not getting any money whatsoever, and I think that's like a a small a small likelihood. I mean, between we could we could, honestly, we could probably go full on courses and and live. Right. And so but there is a small part of me that's like, you're really out over your skis, then you better not you better not fall.

So that's definitely one.

Ian

For if, like, the consulting gigs don't ultimately, you can't charge as much as you might hope. Then that might be a little bit of a setback in how valuable that end of the business might end up being and things

Aaron

like that. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. So I think those are probably my big ones.

Yeah. What else should I be afraid of?

Ian

How's I don't think those are those are, you know, I think I think solid beers. Okay. Good beers. Straight beers. And I don't know if Steve is Steve married?

How's his wife if he has one?

Aaron

No. Steve is not married.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

So Jennifer is incredibly trusting and supportive.

Ian

Nice.

Aaron

You know, she has she the whole time has supported me in thinking about this, and we talked about it a lot and is now supporting me in the actual final, like, decision that we're gonna do this. You know, she is just basically trusting me to provide. And she's, of course, you know, done some slight due diligence with me on our finances and how long we can live, but, really, the ball is in my court to provide. So she's excited for me. I mean, she knows I think she knows what everyone else knows that I've, like, wanted to do this and, like, wanted to try this.

And so she's excited. She's excited for me, and I think she's excited that I'm excited, yeah, which is a nice a nice thing to have in a spouse. Yeah.

Ian

It's really important to have the Yeah. Supporting spouse.

Aaron

Nice nice to, like, actually have somebody on your team. That's kind of a big deal, turns out. So

Ian

I'm glad I'm

Aaron

glad to have that.

Ian

Was huge for, UserScape when we started. Jamie was totally on board with it and she was, we'd always jokingly referred to her as the sugar mama because she was, working and paying the bills. While we sold our car and like we'd

Aaron

put

Ian

rather extreme measures. We didn't, we didn't have as much in the bank. And so it's like really out there And, yeah, couldn't have definitely done it without her support and, belief in all that. So it's so so important to have that. Yeah.

I don't know. Anything else to cover, or should we leave it there? We're at an hour, an hour even.

Aaron

Let's see. I think I think that's about it. Let me see. I don't think there's yeah. I don't think there's anything else.

Ian

So video's out today.

Aaron

Video's out

Ian

in a few minutes. Starting soon. Yeah. Yeah. And I guess we'll we'll get the updates, but I I imagine there'll be stuff you'll be posting stuff publicly fairly often as we go here too.

So that'll be exciting to watch.

Aaron

Yep. And we'll, we'll cover it all here on the pod. So if you have any questions, write down

Ian

and

Aaron

let us let us know. And I it's gonna be I think the last thing I'm super excited about is just, like, the freedom to just not do whatever I want, but, like, be fully into it. Yeah. Like, there's always this tension, and I think it's a healthy tension when you have a full time job, to not, like, to not basically post about your own stuff during the day. Right?

Right. Because you wanna you don't wanna, like

Ian

A bad

Aaron

You don't wanna

Ian

A little bit. You know? Yeah.

Aaron

You know? Yeah. On a Tuesday, and you're, like, launching a new course that is not a part of your job. It's like, ah, this feels a little this feels a little weird. And so now I'm excited to be like, hey.

Look. It's the middle of middle of the workday, and look what I'm working on. And it's it's not, like, in a conflict of interest. So I'm super excited for that. So the posting the posting will, continue until morale improves.

So y'all brace yourselves. The hype

Ian

I do all the

Aaron

The hype is not over, by the way. The hype is not over.

Ian

That's good.

Aaron

We love

Ian

We've we've all the way through.

Aaron

Begun to hype.

Ian

Great. This is where I I I've never been good at this. Partially, I think, because of the market I'm in doesn't really lend itself to it, but great hype is very interesting and intriguing to watch. Like people love great hype. So like the ability to hype something, people love that.

Like if it's done, I think, you know, people have different takes on it. Some people are very sort of like the base camp. You're all fucking idiots. This is the right way you should be doing this stuff. Right?

Like that's their take on the world.

Aaron

Manifesto. Yeah.

Ian

Yeah. Like your take on the world is like the very positive, like, here's the change I'm trying to bring about and, like, what I'm trying to do and follow along with me. And, like, we can all rise these boats together, like, all that, know, when people obviously like that too. So I think that's all really cool. Definitely looking forward to the hype, videos and tweets and everything as it goes, watching all the new channels, sprout up the new Twitter channel and all

Aaron

those things with fun. There's gonna be so much content. Y'all are gonna gonna hate it. It's gonna be

Ian

awesome. One of the things working for yourself too, that you really have to take advantage of, this is like hard to do at the beginning, but I think you should really try to make time is like, so just like, you could just take a day off. Like you can take a day off or you could take the day off and work at night a little bit or whatever. Like and because even now I feel like, man, I didn't I wish I'd taken more days off. And even and and when I look back, I mean, listen, we went to Europe for 3 months and like, we did all kinds of stuff.

And so I've done a lot and I feel good about it, but like, but like give yourself that permission to be like, Hey, I'm gonna go hang out at the pool for the morning with the kids or whatever. And like, especially with the, the business you guys are designing for the most part, you're not gonna have like that much like yeah. Emergency or I have to be somewhere at 10 am. Like I'm sure you'll have some calls and things where yes, you have a meeting with a client and yes, for that hour, you're gonna be busy or a couple hours, whatever, but that's still not gonna be your whole week. It's gonna be, you know, once or twice a week, you have a call like that maybe or whatever.

So, you know, that is one of the upsides of working for yourself is you can do some different things or take the kids somewhere when everybody else is not there. I'm not, I'm not, this is literally like the biggest benefit is like, we're going to go to Disney, you know, in February when nobody's there in the middle of the week or whatever, as opposed to, like, we're there in summer, it's 200 degrees. Everybody in the world's here and we're packed in here, like sardines, like, so you can take advantage of those things, which is really to me is one of the best parts of it all, when you have a family and your own business. So Try to keep an eye out for those things.

Aaron

Yeah. Well, the thing the thing I'm already the thing I've already put on that list is Dune in 70 millimeter. Like, I need to go I need to go see it while it's

Ian

still in IMAX. Yeah. I do wanna do that too. I think it would be awesome. And I think it would be, like, significantly better in IMAX actually than the theater I saw it in.

We don't have good theaters here. So like, it was the biggest screen in my theater, but it was not sufficiently overwhelming. I don't think for the, like, huge sand worm.

Aaron

You want you wanna be blown like, you want your chest to rattle. Yeah.

Ian

That's what I think is the optimal viewing experience. So I would love trying to see if I can get down to the city to do that as well. But, yeah, exactly. Stuff like that. Like, bam, you're gonna go take 3 hours and drink diet Coke or drink water

Aaron

or something. As I can.

Ian

That's fine. Diet Coke free.

Aaron

I'll I'll leave us with another 30 rock anecdote because, you know, we have to. You you were saying you look back and you, like, said, I wish I took more days off or something. In one episode Jack Donaghy has a heart attack, and he comes back to work and he tells Liz Liman, he says, you know I was laying there dying, and all I could think was I wish I had worked more.

Ian

And I

Aaron

thought that is just like the funny That's so funny. Just perfect Jack Donaghy. On my deathbed, I was thinking, I wish I had worked more.

Ian

Oh my gosh. That's really good.

Aaron

So there you go. Go.

Ian

Watch 30 rock. Place to leave it. Watch 30 rock. Alright. Follow us, mostlytechnical.com, mostlytechpod on Twitter, and, email into mostlytechnicalpodcast@gmail.com.

We are starting to get a lot in there. They all get read. They don't all get responded to on air, but we will try our best. And, thanks everybody for, listening, and we'll be following along with Aaron over the next couple of months. It's gonna be super interesting.

Alright. Alright. Thanks.

Aaron

See you.