Your Glove Situation

Ian

Okay. Welcome back. Another episode back on air.

Aaron

Good to be back. Yeah. Missed missed one in the middle there. I got pretty sick, but good to be back.

Ian

You back you back in powerful, feeling strong?

Aaron

No. No. Not even not even a little bit.

Ian

Oh, no. Yeah. Over over the gut illness at least. How about that?

Aaron

Over the illness. Yeah.

Ian

Okay.

Aaron

Over the illness. Got the got the stomach bug that ripped through the family.

Ian

Stomach bug is the worst.

Aaron

Oh, dude. It is the worst. My older son got it first and threw up, like, 6 times, which is just the saddest thing in the world when a kid

Ian

throws up. So pitiful. Yeah.

Aaron

They just look at you all sad, and then they throw up. It's like, oh, buddy. And then my wife got it and was just kinda nauseous and never threw up and was over it in, like, 12 hours. And then I got it and I didn't throw up. I got close, but I got stomach cramps for, like, 18 hours, and I've never had stomach cramps before.

Oh my gosh, I want

Ian

to die.

Aaron

Yes, I was, like, writhing in pain.

Ian

Oh, my gosh.

Aaron

There were points where I was, like, on the floor in the closet curled

Ian

up in

Aaron

a ball. It's like, what is happening?

Ian

Oh, you're really on a run here.

Aaron

Oh, my gosh. What is going on? So, yeah, that was bad. And then I had fever. I had fever for, like, 3 or 4 days.

The kind of fever where you wake up and, like, your sheets are drenched with sweat.

Ian

Well, it's kind of a weird combo. I feel like with the stomach bug, the fever, like, maybe you have a little fever quickly, but you don't usually get the multi day fever with the stomach bug. I feel like that I know.

Aaron

That's what I'm saying.

Ian

Combo there. Wonder if you had 2 things at once. The way your luck's going, I'm guessing you had 2 different things at once.

Aaron

I think that's probably right, the way my luck is going. And then, of course, I'm still in all this, like, just, like, excruciating physical pain, where I can barely, like, lift my arms over my head and can't get up off the ground by myself. It's like, yeah, pretty pretty, pretty bad.

Ian

Any luck there with figuring that out?

Aaron

They they've they've diagnosed me with rheumatoid arthritis by process of elimination, which doesn't give me a lot of confidence.

Ian

Right.

Aaron

Because I don't have the, like, the blood tests to support rheumatoid arthritis. They're like, yeah, you know, in 20% of the cases, you don't have the blood tests, and we just diagnose it anyway. I'm like, that seems convenient, doesn't it? So I'm going to go get a second opinion.

Ian

Yeah. Definitely do that. You got it's so it's so hard because I had some health stuff going on when we had young kids, and it's, like, just, like, going to the doctor is just, like, impossible on top of Yeah. Kids and work and everything. It's it's so rough.

But

Aaron

So rough.

Ian

Do you know if they tested for Lyme disease? I know it's not big down there, but up here, that's a big thing, and it has, like, those kind of symptoms sometimes. Like, I don't know if you know about it, but it's like a tick borne illness, but it's really common of where I live. And, yeah, then they, like, slam you with tons of antibiotics to, to patch you up. But

Aaron

it might be something that you go back

Ian

another test. It's more rare in the south, but it is spreading. So it is, like, more common than it used to be.

Aaron

It used to be. Interesting.

Ian

Didn't exist down there, but, it is I mean, I don't know. Have you traveled up north lately? I don't I don't know what to call a few.

Aaron

Well, we went to we went to, what's it called?

Ian

Oh, it's Vermont. Oh, yeah. Vermont is like a total hotbed of Lyme disease. Yeah. Like, you should definitely check for that.

Mhmm. Like, if you have untreated Lyme disease for, like, now it's been, like, 6 months or whatever, like, absolutely or 4 months or whatever, like, you could have those kinda symptoms. Interesting. So we're we're playing doctor here on the podcast, but Yeah. So something to look into.

Interesting.

Aaron

That is a good oh,

Ian

that would be awesome. Right. I would love to

Aaron

I would love to have Lyme disease. That would be amazing.

Ian

Right. It actually can be quite serious. Of course, it's like, there was a vaccine for it for a little while, but then, like, whatever, something happened, they don't sell it anymore. And I wish they'd just make a vaccine for it, but, I don't know. So no vaccine.

No actual, like, total cure exactly, but they do with a bunch of antibiotics. It usually patches you up. Like, I've had it. My son had it.

Aaron

Really?

Ian

So yeah. I wonder I didn't get that far with it. I didn't have that kind of pain. It was definitely different. Like, because the one of the things is you get a like, if you see the patch on you, it's like a circular, skin rash kind of thing.

Like if you see that, then you just know you have it, but you only get that, like, 30% of the time or something. And also, like, ticks bite you in weird spots where, like, it might bite you in your hairline or, like, wherever. And, you know, it's not even see it even if you get it. So yeah. But it's kinda Bieber and stuff like that.

But it's, like, some of these weird things, it's, like, some people it's quite severe. Some people it's like they live with it forever and don't even know. And yeah. But up here, like everybody get like, when you have a physical, you get Lyme disease tested always, and like kids always get it tested. That'd be physical.

Yeah. It's just like a thing you just do if you live in New York, Connecticut. You know, I think in Vermont and stuff, they would have it up there. So yeah.

Aaron

Interesting.

Ian

Something to check out.

Aaron

Okay. Well, I'm gonna ask if I can get tested for that because I would love an answer.

Ian

Right. Yeah. Especially since you don't have a solid answer, it's, definitely worth digging around in some other more far field things and just getting more more advice. Because a lot of times, you just gotta find the right doctor too, like, go down the right path. But These

Aaron

doctors, man, they just don't freaking care at all.

Ian

The whole system's like, we're gonna move, I think, to this, one of these. So, you know, I assume it's the same down by you, but like doctors now are just like, you got 7 minutes go. What can you tell me? Yes. And it's like, yeah, like, okay, like, here's my whole life story.

Here's everything that's ever happened

Aaron

to me.

Ian

I'm trying to race through it. Right. And they're like, okay. Okay. Uh-huh.

Uh-huh. And then like, okay, here's some tests. Get out of here and, like, onto the next one. So, but they have the doctors where, like, you just basically pay more. There's actual name for these things, but it's like, whatever.

It's like $250. Yeah. But it's like, you get that hour with a doctor, and it's like, yes. That's what I want. And then, like, they can still refer you to specialists that are, like, under your health insurance.

So whatever. If you had to go to a specialist, they refer you and that's fine. Or blood work is still your health insurance. But for the, like, day in, day out, I'm sitting down. I'm having a physical.

Let's go through some something that's going on with me or just in general. How's it going? Like, here's somebody who's gonna sit and listen to me for 20 solid minutes, and we can have a conversation instead of, you're just in the board, and they're just churning you out. And if you don't have, like, obvious cancer or your arms falling off, then, you know, they're just like, get out of here. Yep.

So I don't know. We're thinking about doing that because our we have a $80 co pay anyway. So I'm like, well, $80 co pay or I could pay 2.50, and it's, like, once a year. Like, I'm just gonna start doing that. But yeah.

So it might be worth Yep. Finding one of those types.

Aaron

Yep. Yep. It's it's the worst. They, they come in, they stare at their computer the whole time,

Ian

ask you a couple questions, write a few things

Aaron

down, and then they're like, okay. Well, it's probably this. I'll give you this medicine, and we'll see how it works. Come back in 3 weeks. I'm like, what?

Right. You haven't listened to anything I've been saying.

Ian

Yeah. I had some stuff. I got went down a whole path of, like, wrong medicine on the thing I had. Like, this is years ago, but it's like because they just start they're like, okay. Here.

Take this medicine. And you're like

Aaron

Yes.

Ian

Is it even the right medicine? Like, there's not even necessarily follow-up depending on what it is. Like, okay. Come back in a year, and it's like, just start taking this thing for a year and see if it works. Yeah.

So Yeah. Alright. Well, hopefully, some progress gets made there, man.

Aaron

Hopefully they all have Lyme disease. We'll see. Right. So here's here's a question. You know?

Yeah. Let me start with setting a mutually shared understanding. You know how I always have good ideas that never backfire? Yes. Perfect.

Ian

That that we've established that on the show.

Aaron

Yeah. Multiple times. So what if I took all of these tests, all of these dozens and dozens of blood tests that I've had, and I, like, put them on GitHub, like, on a an open source repo and then turn the Internet loose on it. And I'm like, what do you think I have?

Ian

Yeah. Well, I mean, have you tried the chat gbt version

Aaron

of that? Yeah. I have.

Ian

And it And I don't know, like there.

Aaron

No. Nothing interesting. No.

Ian

I mean, I why not? Like, oh, I mean, the worst case scenario is, like, they're, like, somebody says, hey. You should go to this kind of doctor, and you waste a half a day going to that kind of doctor, and that's it. Like, it seems reasonable. Like

Aaron

I figured I could nerd snipe some people who are like, oh, I bet I could figure it out.

Ian

You got a lot of reach.

Aaron

Yeah. They'll go, like, super far into it. Maybe it ends up on Reddit and everybody, like, nerds out about it for a long time. And then

Ian

Yeah. You have these weird the thing is when you have, like, something that's not totally standard. Right? It's like the whole system's not designed for that. Like nobody's like, there's nobody in charge of figuring that out other than you.

And then to you have to go through. So like when I had a, like the dizziness eye issue stuff going on, which I didn't know was eye issue, like, it was just years of like, well, flare kind of got worse. I'll go to the doctor. Yeah. They'll be like, go for a hearing test, whatever, this and other thing.

I, and it's like, eventually I stumbled on the thing it actually was. And you're like, oh shit. But you know, it took like 8 years

Aaron

or whatever. Right.

Ian

To do that. And then, yeah, maybe there's somebody out there. Like one of the things I did is I wrote a blog post and that blog post actually gets a fair amount of people on it because it's like, Hey, if you have these symptoms, like here's a a weird diagnosis that, nobody is in the world's gonna give you if they're just like a regular eye doctor at your mall. Like, they're not up on this stuff. And so, yeah.

So there are just like weird things that go on with people that if you don't have the regular stuff, you kinda need to find somebody who can point you in the right direction, or you need to grind to the doctor treadmill till you find the one that's willing to dig deeper. So, yeah, I mean, I actually think that's a fine idea. Like, it's not even gonna be giving out your DNA or whatever. It's like, whatever. Here's some blood test.

Like, who cares? What do you think?

Aaron

Who cares? Okay.

Ian

All right.

Aaron

I think I'm gonna do that and see what the, see what the nerds of the Internet think.

Ian

No. I'm gonna get a lot

Aaron

of bad. I'm gonna get a lot of bad. Yeah.

Ian

You bet it

Aaron

should be very

Ian

to filter. Yeah. You gotta have, like, a a strong filter up. Okay? You're gonna get

Aaron

I'm ready.

Ian

Especially if you're putting it on YouTube. I don't know if you're gonna go YouTube with it on YouTube channel or if you're gonna go that far with it or not. If you go that far, like, you're gonna get some, you know, weird weird replies in there. But And

Aaron

I bet about 60% of the replies are gonna be about gut health, which I'm like Right. That's I don't know. That doesn't mean anything. Like, I don't know I don't know what you mean by gut health.

Ian

So it's gonna be that stuff. It's gonna be, you know, are you sure you're not already dead? Are you sure you're alive? Right. You might already be dead.

Like Mhmm. Right. Yeah. All this other stuff are like

Aaron

There's maybe gonna be, like, a 5 percent, like, how dare you have us do the work for you? What a privileged person you are.

Ian

But Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

We'll see.

Ian

I think it hurt. I mean, I'm down right. Yeah. I think

Aaron

it's another. This is another good era and idea.

Ian

I think this is

Aaron

speaking. Speaking of good Aaron ideas, I am officially back on paternity leave as of today.

Ian

Oh, okay. I was kinda wondering about that. It seemed like this would be hard to not be on paternity leave right now.

Aaron

This is hard to not be on paternity leave. Yeah. So I I have 5 more weeks. We get a total of 12, and I was gonna, like, take them later in the year. Right.

And just not not working. So back on paternity, already feeling a sense of relief of, like, okay, I can just focus on getting through this, like, through over the hump with these kids and figuring out some of this health stuff.

Ian

Yeah. That's a lot. That's a lot, man. Even just on the kid even putting aside the health stuff, just on the kid front, like, between birth and 3 months old, like, 3 months old is so much better. Like, there's just gonna be a lot easier to deal with if you get another month or 2 under their belts here.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

You know, 3 or 4 months old or whatever they'll be with when you're done. Feel like that's probably a good move.

Aaron

Yeah. Just just continually punched in the face. So I talked I talked to Holly yesterday, and I was like, listen. I'm I feel really guilty, but I've got to take the rest of this paternity. And she was like, why do you feel guilty?

Take your paternity. So, yeah. You're on paternity.

Ian

Do you have time off? Would you take time off on top, you think? Or

Aaron

I think, like, technically, I could. You know, we have unlimited

Ian

Right. PTO. PTO. Oh, we have unlimited PTO. That's something weird.

I don't I don't I'm not fan of the unlimited

Aaron

PTO. I know. So I don't know, like,

Ian

what am I acceptable there? Like, you're you're getting punched in the face. Does that mean you could take 6 months off? Is that too much?

Aaron

Can you get

Ian

3 weeks off? Can you take 2 weeks off? Like, it feels just much nicer to be like, you get X time off. Everybody knows what you get. Maybe there's extenuating circumstances where, like, you have to work something out with somebody because they need more time, and then that's then the conversation you could have versus, like, sort of weirdo state.

But, alright. Well, it's an option, I guess, too. Yeah. If you need to, oh, what is going on? If you need, like, a little more time too, but they're gonna be a lot lot bigger and better there after even just a little more time.

So

Aaron

Yeah. I

Ian

think they kids, man.

Aaron

Poor kids, man.

Ian

It's gonna it's gonna be a lot for a while.

Aaron

It's too many kids.

Ian

It's a lot of kids.

Aaron

It's too many.

Ian

It's a lot of kids.

Aaron

It's just they're they're everywhere.

Ian

Maybe got eBay 1. Just eBay. They're go down to 3.

Aaron

They're they come in sets. Yeah.

Ian

I mean. It's all of the pair.

Aaron

It's just there's just there's so many of them. Yeah. And the schedules are just like Yeah. They're it's nonstop.

Ian

Yeah. It's nonstop.

Aaron

It's around the clock nonstop.

Ian

And I don't wanna demoralize you, but, here's a little story which might demoralize

Aaron

you. Yeah.

Ian

Which is, so Valentine's day is my, my, oh, that's right. Your birthday.

Aaron

That's right. It's important. Yeah. Important context for this story.

Ian

So me and my wife, we're gonna go celebrate your birthday on Valentine's Day. And, it's our 30th anniversary of our first date because we started dating and she was a freshman in high school. So a long time ago. And so I've been trying to, like, figure out something special to do. Right.

And it's just literally impossible. Like the kids have stuff to do, like trying to get into school. And like, if I'm trying to do an overnight, a single night, one night.

Aaron

1 night.

Ian

One night with my youngest is almost 11. And it's, like, impossible. Impossible. It can't be done. It's like Oh.

I was trying to do it as a surprise. I just told her this morning. I was like, listen. And we have this whole joke where, like, I try to do nice things for her, and they don't work out. And then I have to tell her about the nice thing I was going to do.

Classic. Yeah. Another nice thing I would try. I've spent days trying to work this out. It's impossible.

Like, I have no way I'm gonna be able to do this without including her because, like, there's just too many things in motion. So to have any chance of even doing it is gonna require both of us to, like, call in favors and, you know, all the stuff to make this one night happen. So, yeah, it's it's a lot. Having the multiple kids, there's always somebody doing something. It needs to go somewhere.

They're sick. They're this. They're that. Like

Aaron

So for at least the next 11 years, we have we have you gotta keep me posted to let me know how long it goes.

Ian

My wife's been trying to get get back into the business and do some stuff, and but it's so hot. Like from, I think it was like something like early November to last week. I think it was there hasn't been a single day where the kids, at least one kid wasn't home. Like, it's crazy. Like, because people were sick, then there was time off, then there was holidays, and there was something else, and they had days off of school.

Like, it's, like, unbelievable. They're just, like, always

Aaron

stuff all

Ian

the time. They're just there. They're there all the time. So

Aaron

Oh, perfect. Yeah. Good good to know.

Ian

Very good.

Aaron

Yeah. Thanks. Awesome.

Ian

This kinda ties in. Should we should we do your, your your what you put on the list here with diapers? That kinda merges in. Because I got some bad news around that too for you. So we'll go with full of bad news.

Aaron

Yeah. Listen, let me tell you. So I'm a pretty normal guy.

Ian

Oh, yeah.

Aaron

Sure. Yeah. And, you know, I think I think maybe this is is weird. I'm I'm the only person I know that that does this.

Ian

But I

Aaron

think this is the I think this is the reasonable position, and everyone else is unreasonable. Okay. I've changed a lot of diapers. Okay? I've changed a

Ian

You're a pro.

Aaron

Lot. A lot of diapers and continue to this day to change a lot of diapers. There's not been one. Well, I'll I'll say there are fewer than than a handful, so fewer than 5 times that I've changed a diaper without wearing gloves or a single glove. We'll say a single a single glove.

Ian

Oh, Michael Jackson it.

Aaron

He's got the white glove. Single I'm usually a single

Ian

glove. Just a hot changer. Glove, I assume. Not the one that's Yes. Yeah.

Aaron

I gotcha. Every single diaper I have ever changed, save for a few rare emergencies, I've worn a surgical glove to change the

Ian

diaper. Wild. I I I don't think I've ever heard of this.

Aaron

The objective, like, objectively,

Ian

glove when you're when you're

Aaron

down there in the danger zone. I don't understand why people my friends make fun of me for this. Yeah. I don't understand. I learned this because I saw it when we first I'd never ever ever in my life changed a diaper before we had kids.

Why would I? Right.

Ian

Why would

Aaron

I change a diaper? I don't need to change other people's other kids' diapers. No. At the hospital, they've got those gloves on the wall. Right?

They've got 3 boxes of gloves, small, medium, large. Doctors walks in walks in and they put on a new pair of gloves. I see the nurses putting on gloves to change diapers, and I'm like,

Ian

right, Yeah.

Aaron

I'm doing this clicks.

Ian

I don't

Aaron

wanna touch that stuff. And so I'm grabbing I'm grabbing gloves off the wall. When we left, I took a whole box. Like, I paid $1,000,000 to be here. I'm gonna take a box of gloves home with me.

Ian

I love it.

Aaron

And then when we ran out, I just ordered more off Amazon, and I've never stopped.

Ian

So I guess let's just start. I assume I I feel like I gotta set the scene a little. I assume we're not we're not a cloth diaper family. Let's just start there.

Aaron

No. No. Nobody got time for that. Yeah.

Ian

I agree. We can't deal with the clock.

Aaron

Sorry to Earth or whatever, but nobody's got time for that. Right.

Ian

Alright. So we're we're regular diapers. I have to say, I feel like I'm not totally opposed to this, but it does feel like an extra step, which I don't know if I love the extra step exactly. Although I guess if you're going in, are you feeling like you then don't do you not have to hand wash post? Like, are you clean?

Aaron

Oh, no. Still you still hit the you still hit the,

Ian

You still hand wash?

Aaron

The pump.

Ian

What's it called?

Aaron

Sanitizer next to the changing station post.

Ian

Faster than a full hand wash.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

Time wise, it's okay. You don't you don't have any issues with, like, speed wise there? It doesn't make

Aaron

your time. Speed wise. Pick them up, put them on the table, open the drawer, put a glove on, change What about then you're done.

Ian

What about your wife?

Aaron

Oh, no. She's she's She's talking about natural.

Ian

Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Aaron

Yeah. No. Never never in her life. She's she's gonna

Ian

understand it. I don't know. I have to say I'm I'm glad I'm out of the diaper zone. I mean, I guess I feel like we my my path to it was more like if you go with the proper wipe technique

Aaron

No. There's

Ian

fairly rare that you get it actually on your hands. Fairly.

Aaron

Rare. Not Fairly fairly rare is enough just for the record. Fairly rare is is enough. Yeah. That's already that's

Ian

already too much.

Aaron

I don't I

Ian

mean, we're talking blown away by this. I haven't even really considered it. Like, it's

Aaron

If we're talking about 1%

Ian

this is tight. If

Aaron

we're talking about 1% chance, I'm Yeah. I'm wearing a glove. Yeah.

Ian

Okay. Alright. I don't It's like a Yeah. It's like a condom like situation here. You're going with the odds.

Aaron

Sure. Yeah. Gotcha. In in a way. Yeah.

I just don't want I just there's you never know. First of all, you never know what you're gonna find.

Ian

My follow-up to this is so perfect because it's just so perfect. Alright. So Yeah. When I read this, here was my reaction. My reaction is that this whole, like people get excited about being done with diapers.

But that being done with diapers is sort of a lie that you're told as a parent, like that is this end zone of like, once they're out of the diapers, right, then Mhmm. We're free. But it's really not true. Like, it's it's good to be out of diapers. Like, you're sick of buying them.

You're sick of throwing them out. Like, so that part's all good. It's it's definitely a big moment and you are happy for it to arrive. But the wiping of the asses does not stop for a very long time after that. Yes.

So you have lots of ass wiping to go. You have years of ass wiping. What? And this ass wiping is not gonna be on your terms like the diaper is. The diaper is beautiful.

Like, you pick them up. You put them down. They don't move. You you zip them around. You clean them up.

It's great.

Aaron

Yeah.

Ian

When you're just at Target and the filthy toilet and they have to go and they're there and you have to wipe them, What are you gonna do now with your glove situation? Oh my god.

Aaron

This is

Ian

adult like poop? Oh, it's terrible.

Aaron

This is news to me. I'll be honest. I'll be honest. I thought at some point,

Ian

you just transition

Aaron

out of diapers, and then you never say again.

Ian

Letting you in on the secret. I hate to do it.

Aaron

Not a good day for me, Ian. This is

Ian

a bad bad day.

Aaron

Telling me a lot of things I don't wanna hear.

Ian

Oh, man. But it's true. They just poop in the worst places, and they can't, and they need help. And they didn't make it there. So now you're dealing with, like

Aaron

Oh my gosh. Gosh.

Ian

I do not wanna know any of this. Got a underwear full of poop that you're dealing with. Like

Aaron

I don't wanna know any of this.

Ian

Oh, man. Pulling over Tell

Aaron

me I'm gonna be in I'm gonna be in gloves for the next 10 years too?

Ian

I'm saying you're gonna have, like, people wear phones strapped to their belts. You're gonna have, like, that, but for, like, a glove dispenser where you're just like, boom. No problem, kids. Bam. Oh my gosh.

Well Yeah. I'm excited to follow-up in a couple of years

Aaron

or 2 weeks. Plans.

Ian

Well, I guess the I guess the oldest ones are close. Right? They're close. So if you get them out of diapers,

Aaron

we'll kind of follow-up

Ian

fairly soon.

Aaron

Yeah. We tried we tried already once, and it didn't take. And so we'll try again at some point. But

Ian

yeah. Yeah. One little gross tip, for you as you exit the diaper.

Aaron

I want it. I don't know if I. Okay. Yeah.

Ian

This is a good one. This is a good one. They make for the car k. These potties that are, like, cold flat, and you open the potty, and then you use a gallon ziplock bag as

Aaron

It's the worst thing I've ever heard in my life.

Ian

And then if you emergency have to go poopy, it's a boom. You pop them on that thing. You seal up the little ziplock baggy. You're good to go. Yeah.

No.

Aaron

I I refuse

Ian

to acknowledge this.

Aaron

No. When

Ian

they're when they're pooping in your 4 Runner, you're gonna be like, oh, I wish I had one of those ziplock bag toilet.

Aaron

Suddenly suddenly, I'm I'm I'm wondering if I'm cut out for any

Ian

of this. You're a little late now. I don't know.

Aaron

Like, I'm I'm kinda barely scraping by, and you're telling me it gets worse. That's bad.

Ian

Oh, worse. It's it's it's better, but there are still challenges. There are still challenges. They're still challenges. It's like it's the same thing with when they're little babies, and you're like, great.

I put them down. You're like, this is I got I I need them to walk because it's so much better when they can walk. So then they start walking and then they're into everything and then you gotta watch them. They're walking in the road. They're doing the so, like, that's its own new set of challenges.

And that's the same kind of thing with the pooping. It's like, you you leave the one phase, and that's good and happy, but then you get the new phase has its own its own challenges that you have to deal with.

Aaron

Well, I'll keep you up to date on my strategies because I feel like the nitrile glove from Amazon is a pretty good strategy, and we'll we'll see what I invent for the next the next phase.

Ian

Oh my gosh. Alright. Alright. Any other kids stuff we need to cover? Kids, otherwise, are there they're doing alright?

Aaron

Kids otherwise are doing are doing alright. Yeah. I think I think we're all good there. I have been working. I'll I'll be I'll be curious to get your take on this.

I've been working on you know, people are asking, like, hey. How's it going? How are you doing? And, you know, there's like a there's like a polite, a polite way to respond. So, like, hey.

How's it going? How are you doing? Right. And then there's, like, the the suburban dad way

Ian

of responding.

Aaron

There's, like, a I feel like there's a a suburban dad scale of

Ian

Mhmm.

Aaron

How you're doing. Yeah. But I've kinda been I've kinda been, like I've been workshopping the suburban dad scale of how you're doing. At the top of the

Ian

scale No.

Aaron

When you ask when you ask a dad at a barbecue how you're doing, top of the scale, living the dream. That's the top. That guy that guy is watching football. He's got jet skis in his driveway for some reason. That guy, that's the that's as good as it gets.

Right?

Ian

Well, okay. I I so I already have a question because I do feel like that is like it's like the ace. Like, the ace could be the top of the straight, or it could be the bottom of the straight. Like, I feel like it's a lot in the inflection. Like, you know, you could have the negative version of that Yes.

Collected negatively, and you're like, oh, man. This guy is way down in the weeds.

Aaron

He's he's hateful. Unironic unironic. Living the

Ian

dream.

Aaron

Living the dream. Maxed out. Yeah.

Ian

He's drinking beers. He's watching football. Beer.

Aaron

He motorsports. Bringing him food.

Ian

His team won. Cigar. Yeah. Gotcha.

Aaron

Exactly. Exactly. So below right below that, still on the positive side is

Ian

Yep.

Aaron

No complaints. No complaints.

Ian

Okay. Alright. Right?

Aaron

That's still, like he's not living above water.

Ian

His head's above water.

Aaron

His head's above water. We're still on the positive side of the line. No complaints.

Ian

Right. I think there's only 2. I think there's only 2. There's only, yeah, there's only 2

Aaron

on the positive side of the line. Yeah. Then then below that Mhmm. How how how are you doing? Oh, we're making it.

Ian

Making oh, yeah. That's below the line for sure.

Aaron

That's below the line. Right?

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron

That's not all the way that's not all the way down, but it's like

Ian

You're not yeah. You can still see white. You're not down in the depths, but it's not good.

Aaron

We're not we're not even at doom points. Yeah. We're we're making it. And then at I think at the bottom is well, the bottom has a range or the bottom has modifiers, but the the beginning of the bottom is hanging in there.

Ian

Right. Hanging in. Right. That's the most. Right?

Yeah. Hanging in implies, like, could you know that they're being nice about it? So it's like hanging in is, like it's probably pretty bad, but it's like Yes. Whatever. They're not suicidal yet, so they're hanging in.

Aaron

But the but it has a scale. Right? So you're you're hanging in there or you're barely hanging in there.

Ian

Yeah. Barely hanging in.

Aaron

Yeah. And so that's that's, like, oh, uh-oh. Yeah. And then and then there's the the variable modifier of of man. Right?

So

Ian

Oh, no. You don't wanna hear the man.

Aaron

You don't wanna hear you don't wanna hear man because and the longer

Ian

the man goes, the worse the guy is doing. Right? So if

Aaron

you say, man goes, the worse the guy is doing. Right? So if you say, man, we're barely hanging in there. It's like, oh. That's trouble.

Say, man, we're barely hanging in there. It's like, oh. That's trouble. Say, man, we're barely hanging in there. Oh, that guy is almost gone.

Ian

Right? Getting divorced. It's like, yes. Yeah. It's alright.

Aaron

Yeah. It is over. Yeah.

Ian

I'm with you.

Aaron

So I feel like I feel like this.

Ian

I think he got it at a scale.

Aaron

It's pretty solid. Scale. Right?

Ian

Yeah. I don't have any additions there.

Aaron

That's the polite way to respond at a barbecue. Like, how you doing?

Ian

Yeah. Have you ever had that so have you ever been doing so bad that you broke down the badness, or do you stick with the scale?

Aaron

You know, if it's if it's actual friends, I'll I'll break it down, but most of the time, it's just it's the scale for sure.

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. That's enough.

Aaron

Yeah. Good people play that.

Ian

And the

Aaron

thing is, because if it's not friends, they don't wanna know. Especially if they're living the dream. They don't want to know.

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, the living the dream guy.

Aaron

They're just asking, I'd love to be a living the dream guy. Can you imagine?

Ian

He sold his business. Yeah. He's fly fishing during the day. Exactly. He's working out 5 times a week.

He's looking he's

Aaron

looking around. In the yard looking at stuff. What's he looking at? I don't know. He's just looking at stuff.

Ian

He's gonna do his plantings. He's getting ready.

Aaron

Oh. Gonna have some

Ian

plantings this year. Okay.

Aaron

Well, good. Suburban suburban dad scale.

Ian

I have nothing to add to that. I think I think you've you've dialed it in.

Aaron

I thought about it a lot. I've been I've been thinking about it.

Ian

You've had time, like, when you're rocking a baby or feeding a baby, you're like, let me figure out this scale. Yeah. And I like it. Alright.

Aaron

Yeah. Alright.

Ian

What else do you wanna do here? We got things. We got, I don't know. Do you

Aaron

wanna about your poker tournament.

Ian

There's nothing much to this one. It was went down to Bogota. I ended up,

Aaron

like, at a surprise poker tournament because you DM'd me and you're like, hey. You can't record. I gotta I'm doing a poker tournament now. And I'm like,

Ian

yeah. Yeah. Well, so I was gonna go to a poke. I had planned to go to a poker tournament. So I was like, whatever I had to push in the button to reset the database, all the fricking beginning of winter and whatever that was over.

And then I was like, all right, I'm gonna go to poker tournament, kind of reset my brain. I like the competition. I like the like using my brain in a different way from the like internet technology stuff. Like that sit there with the other mutants who are like right. Have their weird stories and things that happen at poker table.

But then I got the COVID, so I'm sick with COVID. So then that messed up me going to my poker tournament. So I was like, oh, forget. I mean, I couldn't go. I was like, so okay.

Fine. I'm not gonna go. Then I realized this this was like a tournament series and that there was actually one more tournament. I could go to if I like whatever I realized I could go. So that's why I messaged you.

I'm like, you can't score. And so I'm like, alright, we're gonna head down to this poker tournament. So head down there. I made it to day 2, so it was a multi day tournament. So I got through day 1, made day 2 lost focus,

Aaron

sort of

Ian

lost focus. I was intentionally doing what I was doing, but it was just a little too, it was a little too ambitious. I was making too ambitious a play. Got into a spot on the flop where I just had to go with it, so I went with it. And, I lost.

So that was it, and I was out. So is this, like, an

Aaron

invite or, like, you have to qualify for the tournament?

Ian

Just pay money.

Aaron

This is the beauty of

Ian

the beauty of poker because it's, like

Aaron

the buy in.

Ian

This one was, like, 2,000 or something like that. So it's

Aaron

And what did you stand to to win? Like, what is the winner? I guess.

Ian

I think the winner was, like, 400,000 or something like that. Oh, woah. Yeah. No. Maybe it's, like, 3

Aaron

years old. At the level that you you exited at, do you get anything?

Ian

I got nothing. No. I got nothing.

Aaron

Oh, no.

Ian

I got nothing. Yep. That was a bummer. So, yeah. But it wasn't too exciting.

I don't know. Like, I've been trying to I wanted to play more tournaments because this is gonna be my year of tournaments. I think that's the way I'm currently thinking about it. I'm kind of bored of the cash games. Like, I know how to beat the cash games, which is nice.

You just go there and win money, which is fine. Not every time, but the majority of time, but, but it's also kind of boring. So trying to get better at tournaments, Torments are more where like the glory is in poker. This is kind of like, so I don't know. So we kind of warm up might go wsop, which is like the big tournament series, the like famous tournament series in the, summer.

But I don't know the play the, you know, in these tournaments that have, like, larger buy ins, like, the players are very good and they're very studied and there's all these tools now to study and programs and things like that, which I don't have time to delve as deep as obviously a professional poker player does. So, Yeah. So I don't know. This one was not too exciting. I was a little, little disappointed.

I did, however, then, so I try to keep my comps up. So I get the free rooms. The free rooms make it nicer to go play poker tournaments because if you have to, like, pay for the room, kind of another fee. And So I won, like, $3,000 playing roulette. So there we go.

Aaron

What?

Ian

So yeah. That was good.

Aaron

So you came home up?

Ian

I was up. So it was fun.

Aaron

That's amazing.

Ian

Yeah. That was pretty good. I had a nice little run on the roulette table. So That's crazy. I love roulette.

Roulette is my alternative to poker because there's zero thinking. Like, everything else still has some level of thinking. No thinking. Pick a number. Okay?

I'll pick a number. Let's see if it hits. Great. It does. Awesome.

Woah. It doesn't So

Aaron

what's what's your strategy there? Do you do red black? You do pick, like, an actual individual number?

Ian

Yeah. You got to pick the number.

Aaron

Don't don't don't don't

Ian

like the red black.

Aaron

Don't do that to me. What do I what do I know about gambling?

Ian

I mean, you can pick red black, but, like, it's no fun. You gotta you gotta have some take some risks. Pick a number. Pick a couple numbers. Put the money out there.

Aaron

And that's what you do. Pick a couple individuals.

Ian

Couple numbers. Yeah. Yeah. I have, like, ones that I usually pick my birthday, my wife's birthday. You know, I'm always the full old man status.

Like, I got my my handful of numbers, right, that I pick. Yeah. I'll do a couple other random ones. That's it. And then, either way that comps

Aaron

You hit enough of those to get 3 grand to win 3 grand?

Ian

Well, because it was that Should

Aaron

I gamble? Is gambling You

Ian

should gamble. We gotta get you gambling. We'll get you gambling. Don't worry about it. So there's, like, there are these so if you go to a table that's, like, I don't know what the minimum usually is like $50 a bet, which is not $50 on a single number.

It's not across all your bets on table. It's $50. That's a lot of that. Billion. You play at a better table, which has only 1 0, which is a superior table to

Aaron

One0 on the wheel?

Ian

23. Yeah. No. Right. So you get better odds, blah, blah, blah, blah.

So it pays more to you, basically. So it's almost it it's the one of the better bets because it's, like, losing not too much to the house. So you could play for almost a year.

Aaron

Thing. That's what you're telling me.

Ian

Well, you know, you're sure they could lose money, but I also have an ulterior motive, which is to get free rooms. So I get the free rooms.

Aaron

Free, technically.

Ian

Yeah. Free. I'm paying, I'm paying the house rate on a low rate game and it's like balances out, because the rooms are actually quite expensive at some of these places. So, you know, the free room is nice. Then you win sometimes, which is nice.

Had some dinner, had a nice steak, but I came home. This is a this was my first long trip in the EV, so that was a little bit of an adventure.

Aaron

Oh, wow. And you made it?

Ian

That was good. I made it. I made it there and back, stopped, both through. I didn't I could have made it there without stopping, but they don't really have a good charging setup there or whatever. So I was like, well, I'll just stop.

So I have energy still for the way back, and then I stopped the way back. It was fine. Like ran in Dunkin Donuts and got a tea, took like 15 minutes to hit the road. So it was good. No problem.

That's great. Yep. The way home, I stopped in this, like, outlet mall thing that has a charging station. So it was there. I walked around that quick just to do something, come back out.

There's literally a SWAT team surrounding a band. Dogs are barking, like police dogs. It's like a whole situation. I don't know what was going on, but somebody was getting arrested for something. There was some kind of

Aaron

You didn't stay to watch?

Ian

I mean, though, it was kind of over when I came back out. It seemed like they had arrested whoever they were arresting, and they were, like, just securing the scene. Like, they were going through the van and stuff, but there wasn't didn't seem like there was any more action to be had. So So you just threw your

Aaron

discount merchandise in the truck and drove off,

Ian

I I didn't buy any discount merchandise, to be fair. But, yeah. Man. Just drove off. Just drove off.

I don't know. I haven't and then the other night, I had a yesterday, I went skiing and got stuck on a chairlift for 20 minutes, and it's cold up there.

Aaron

It's because skiing sucks.

Ian

So I drag everything. Everything. I'm thinking about you the whole time. I'm dragging them all the shit. Yep.

Like, at least the kids could carry their own stuff, so it's it's better. But still you're dragging heavy skis and all this stuff. This is where snowboarding is far superior, because it's just like you wear comfy boots and then the

Aaron

boots are great

Ian

for snowboarding. It's like, yes, I don't have all this other stuff. The skis, you have 2 poles and 2 skis and heavy terrible boots and all the stuff. So whatever. But I don't snowboard, so I get all my shit, dragging it around, whatever.

It was a nice little day at the mountain other than getting stuck in lift. It was that snowed, which is rare, and, yeah, it was good. That was a good day out in nature in the winter, which is nice. But, yeah. That's kinda been my action.

Not not as exciting as as your action.

Aaron

Yeah. I'll take your action over mine.

Ian

Okay. I get the kids scanned. When you drag before skiing, it's going to be awesome.

Aaron

I'm just I'm just telling you now, there's no chance. There's there's just no chance. I'm just not gonna do it. Neither will Jennifer. Jennifer just won't do it.

Ian

Does she ski? No. No. Okay. No.

Yeah. That hurts your odds too. Yeah. Poor kid.

Aaron

Living in Texas with 2 parents that don't really care to ski. Yeah. They these these poor kids. Yeah.

Ian

They're just not When they go to college, maybe they'll They'll

Aaron

go to college

Ian

and get some skiing.

Aaron

Their friends, and they'll be the bad ones just like I was the bad one, and it's like, it's fine. You still have fun. Doesn't matter.

Ian

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, man.

Aaron

Alright. You wanna talk once?

Ian

Sure.

Aaron

What do you think? They released it.

Ian

Good. Campfire. Exactly what I thought it would be. I don't know. Fun.

So it's not that exciting. It's like, I don't think anybody's gonna really, replace a real bird instance of Slack. Maybe a few people are gonna

Aaron

replace a real instance of Slack.

Ian

I just don't think a lot of people are gonna do that. I think some people are gonna replace it for things that they shouldn't have been paying Slack for to begin with, and some people are gonna you know, as far as I can like, 90% of the people I see talk about are literally just going through the code to see deal

Aaron

code, which

Ian

is all I, which is what I thought the majority of sales would be. And they seem to be that. And then, you know, there's some people who maybe were paying for slack for communities, which is a total rip off. And so, yes, maybe they'll replace it fine. I mean, I don't think like Salesforce is awake at night being like, oh man, this 299 with no support app is gonna like kill us.

Like, and then, yeah, I don't think any business people are ever gonna think about it. Like no regular business person's gonna be like, boy, let me see what alternatives are to Slack and come across this and be like, yeah, this is the thing I get to go to IT and beg them to install this thing. That's gotten no support and blah, blah. Like it's not, nobody wants that. It's not like people are buying as a business process tool.

So I think people who want free just go to Teams or whatever, like, since they're already paying Microsoft.

Aaron

Yeah. But Yeah. I don't know. I think it's kinda cool. It looks, you know, it looks a little base camp has that certain way of designing things that I don't super love.

It always looks a little underdone or a

Ian

little They're designed. Yeah.

Aaron

Cartoony. Yeah. I don't I don't super love it, but I appreciate that they're doing something different. Same with the Cybertruck. Don't love the way it looks, but I'm glad somebody's trying something.

But I think it's great. I think the way they've set it up is I think it's, I think it's has no email. It has no

Ian

right. I think

Aaron

it's a sequel light database. Yep. And so they've done a lot of things that are, like, dependency free, which I think is really interesting and helps their whole, like, you can self host this shit. Yeah. And I have seen, you know, not normal businesses, but communities, are a big one that have been like, yeah, we we're definitely gonna move to this because Slack is, you know, prohibitively expensive for our communities.

Right. And I think that's fine.

Ian

Yeah. But I mean, you can also use Discord. You could have also used,

Aaron

have you used Discord?

Ian

Tusk or whatever. Whatever that was. The other one that's like a forum. Discuss

Aaron

is the, web based forum. Discord is the one for degenerate gamers. Yeah.

Ian

There we go. Right. Yeah. Discord. I like Discord.

I think Discord's alright.

Aaron

You don't like this? No. Discord's terrible.

Ian

Yeah. I don't think yeah. I think it's fine.

Aaron

Discord is is chaotic. There's you it's impossible to use. Really? Discord is Discord is Slack. No.

It's not like Slack. It's way, way worse.

Ian

I mean, if you use it, I I if I I never use it beyond just, like, I'm in here asking a question or, like, I'm typing something just, like, into a chat box. Like, I'm not doing anything fancy, but paint the phone.

Aaron

No. It's terrible. I'm surprised. I think young people like Discord.

Ian

Yeah. If you're doing a community site, I feel like to not do it on Discord is actually probably not a good move overall because like that's where everybody else's community sites are. And now Yeah. I have to remember to go to your one slack alternative thing instead of just being in discord and seeing your icon there next to all the other icons of all the other communities I'm part of. So I feel like that's kind of a negative, pretty big negative, honestly, of, like, running a community site, on some off purpose server somewhere.

But Yeah. You know, obviously, it depends and, like, geeky tech people are a little bit different. Yeah. They're gonna go to that weirdo Slack because that's where people hang out, whatever. Fine.

But I don't know, like if you were doing a game game chat thing, but of course you're doing discord or even if you're doing like, even with random people, I feel like discord's gonna be better. They're more likely to already have it, blah blah blah. Like, it has a mobile app, which people like.

Aaron

Yeah. I'm curious. I'm curious when I'll get invited to my first weirdo Slack, my first campfire.

Ian

You're not going to? Not gonna You

Aaron

don't think so? No. Not gonna happen?

Ian

I don't think it happened. Maybe.

Aaron

I don't know.

Ian

Has it happened yet?

Aaron

Hasn't happened yet. I think woah.

Ian

People are just in there just looking at DHHS code, man. They're not they're not they're not running things on this.

Aaron

I think conferences could could do it. It could be good for conferences to spin up something and have a bunch of people join and then and then tear it back down.

Ian

I don't know. I mean, that's community moderation tools. Like, it's got obviously no moderation tools. Like, I don't know. It's okay, I guess.

Aaron

You just You know, it's pretty

Ian

bare bones. You're

Aaron

so down on it.

Ian

I'm not I'm not down on it, but I'm it just is what it is. Right? Like, I think it's not I think it their the home page is still one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen compared to what they shipped. Like it has nothing at all to do with what they shipped. It's totally wrong still in everything they said, what they shipped doesn't make it right.

It's still wrong and whatever. I don't think you're gonna see like, oh man, this thing, maybe I'll be wrong. Who knows? I just don't think you're gonna be like, oh, every slack community is now one of these things. I and it's also inevitable that the ones that go on it are gonna someday be like, yeah.

You know what? With the guy who maintained the server, he's gone, and nobody knows how to log in to the server. And now what do we do? Oh, we're just gonna move to Discord because that's the obvious thing to do. Like, I I don't know.

I just think, like, that's like we've we know how this works. We've seen on premise software. Like, we know we know the answers. It's like people have pretending that they forgot. See, people out there are talking about, like, this is some revolution.

Like, we this is, like, full old manuals at cloud, I guess, but like, we know what happens. People don't want to run their own servers. They don't want to, like, are the can you come up with some niches that want to? Yes, you can. Can you tell me how your use case is special flower and you're gonna take care of it like little baby?

Fine. Great. But, like, otherwise, nobody wants to do that. It's terrible. Everybody knows it's terrible.

Aaron

Oh, that's what I was like.

Ian

Everybody's gone who's a coder has gone in and looked at that server that you have in forge. You don't even remember why you spun it up. It's it fully named, and you're like, it's 6 PHP versions old, and it's Laravel 5. And you're like, what the hell am I gonna do with this thing? Like, it's the same exact thing.

Like, nobody's gonna wanna deal with this to save no money if you use Discord or a few bucks if you use Slack when you already can use Teams for free probably anyway. Like, so just a weird value proposition. That's fine. And some people will use it, and that's great. I'm not down on it.

Fine. But, like, it's not revolutionizing anything. It's not replacing fun.

Aaron

Is so is that the is that the sticky wicket for you? They claim they're revolutionizing

Ian

Yes. Of Of course. Yeah.

Aaron

They're like

Ian

we're just like, hey. We've had some time, and we thought this would be cool. Fine.

Aaron

But you think that the claiming that it's a movement, that's

Ian

the problem. To make everything a movement. Right? Like, they always have to make everything's a movement. Like, we can't just do this thing and, like, we do it because it's right for us.

It's like, no, we're doing this thing. Everybody should do this thing. This is the way the world is going when it's obviously not the way the world's going. It's just it's never been a worst time to host your own server. Like, literally, I guess the worst time ever.

And tomorrow is worse than today. Every day is worse than yesterday in terms of hosting your own servers. Like it's, there's just more attack vectors than ever. There's more people who can attack you than ever. There's more automation in attacking you than ever.

There's more like solidification of what people should do and why they should attack you to steal money from you or to ransom where you are, all these things. It's all bad. And that, like and this we will lead into a thing that happened to me this week where we signed up for a service. We point a c name at their, you know, some URL they gave us and whatever we stopped using the service forever ago They'll cut the story short. It's more complicated than this, but basically they lost control that domain and somebody bought that domain essentially and redirected this subdomain.

We had pointed at them to some bad site where you download stuff. Really? It wasn't attack to us. It was like, it was more at this original service where, had a lot of people pointing inbound to it with sub domains from good domains. And they realized that they could redirect those and point them at whatever they want.

So they pointed them at, you know, some hacky download stuff. Smart. And Google webmaster tools notified us that like, hey, Don't you know, URL on your site is pointing to malicious stuff. Maybe you've been hacked or whatever, which, you know, you should all sign up for Google Webmaster Tools if you haven't, because it actually does do some nice things like that even though it's very googly and they don't help you and it's kinda horrible and the actual implementation, but ultimately it did tell us about this. So yeah, there's just like you know, so whatever I just I you know removed the dns entry and fixed it and that was that but still like there's just people looking to do shady stuff all the time.

And, why do you wanna be responsible for protecting anything from the shady people? Like I want the lowest I I do it for our customers, and that's it. And I don't wanna do any more than that. The not I don't wanna do any more at all. Like, that's the most I wanna do.

And I don't even wanna do that, but I definitely don't wanna do like, I have a chat server somewhere that I'm responsible for securing. The past.

Aaron

I saw you I saw you talk in your own your own book again when DHH and crew got a a DDoS attack, and they put Cloudflare in front of

Ian

it. Cloudflare.

Aaron

And you you quote you quote tweeted and said everyone should use Cloudflare for everything. And I almost responded and said, you should disclose that you're an investor in Cloudflare.

Ian

I love Cloudflare. Cloudflare. Use it. It's the best. They'd save DHH.

If it gets DHH doesn't wanna run anything on the Internet anymore and everything's offline, he manages everything himself and his little whatever from Malibu or whatever, even he uses Cloudflare. So just go use Cloudflare. It's so much better. It's amazing. DJ's actually tweeted at me.

I don't know if you saw that. He he was, like, fumpy with me. He was fumpy with me.

Aaron

I'm shocked.

Ian

I thought I know. And I didn't get all into it with him, whatever, but, like, he thought I was saying well, I thought he was saying, and I think he was saying this, but whatever. Because I had said something in my quote tweet about like, they're going to, like, ramp up servers with their host or whatever. And everybody says to me, like, that's stupid. You don't ramp up servers for dial service tech, which yes, I know.

Aaron

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ian

But that's what he said. He said that they were going to their their colo provider and getting their help, which a colo provider is not gonna do diddly swap for your DDoS attack. Like, that's not what they do. Like Correct. They might have some little half ass load balanced firewall thing, but that's not gonna do anything.

So I assumed he was going to get more servers, which I thought was weird, but that's what he said. So whatever. So then he was like, I didn't you know, whatever. That's stupid. We wouldn't do that.

I'm fine. Like, so I didn't go back and forth with them on it, but I get that you don't that's not what you do for DDoS. What you do is you get Cloudflare, which is what he did, which is great.

Aaron

I can't believe I missed the the e n d h h combo.

Ian

Yeah. We had a little combo.

Aaron

Well, that's exciting. We should have him on the show.

Ian

Yeah. I guess we should someday. That would be kind of fun.

Aaron

That would are you kidding me? That would be so much fun.

Ian

That would be fun. Have DHH on here. I wrote Jason Freed. Jason Freed. I I generally agree with Jason Freed.

DHH, he's a little he's a little much. He's, like, always, like, you know, just always selling. But maybe someday. Maybe someday.

Aaron

Maybe someday. Once once we're bigger.

Ian

Once we're bigger. We gotta be big enough. We gotta we gotta approach him, mano a mano. We gotta be equals. Yeah.

We'll get there.

Aaron

Alright. Anything else?

Ian

No. I'm good. It was a a not a barely technical. So people

Aaron

Barely technical.

Ian

Barely technical. Alright. Thanks everybody. Aaron get back to these kids here. So follow us on mostlytechnical.com, mostlytechpod on Twitter, mostly technical podcast atgmail, and, we will be back to you soonish, next week or 2.

Kinda how things are going. Talk to you soon. See you.